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9, 1999
56 TO 110

ss Laura Staines and Michael Giardino

Professional Planner & Architect
Direct Testimony

Cross-Examination by the Planning Board

Below is the transcript from the Weehawken Planning Board Hearing on December 9th, 1999.  This html document follows the format of the official transcript. The transcript format has 25 lines per page. Each page is numbered. Because the transcript is so long, the file has been broken down into 4 different web pages.

Jump to 12/09/99 pages 1  to 55
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Jump to 12/09/99 pages 167  to 211 (end of transcript)

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1 total of 1632 dwelling units and utilizing
2 marketing information provided by our
3 clients and utilizing our own professional
4 planning experience, we identified square
5 footages that were applicable to a variety
6 of residential uses, multiply the total
7 number of residential uses by the
8 respective square footage for each of the
9 proposed uses, whether they be town houses,
10 apartments, senior housing facilities, and
11 the related common areas that are requeset
12 thereto.
13 The total square footage that we
14 generated on that basis was 1,880,220
15 square feet.
16 MR. KIENZ: I am sorry.
17 How did you get that number just
18 once more?
19 MS. STAINES: Certainly.
20 We identified a variety of
21 residential uses. When I pointed out there
22 were 1632 dwellings, there are a number of
23 different characteristics. Some are luxury
24 town houses in excess of 3,000 square feet
25 of living area. The senior housing
1 building may contain dwelling units as
2 small as 600 square feet. The residential
3 apartments may range from 800 to 1200
4 square feet.
5 We applied square footages as a
6 range for the respective different
7 residential types and multiplied them by
8 the appropriate numbers of residential
9 units in each category. They are
10 approximations.
11 Since this number is well below the
12 allowable square footage, we felt confident
13 that regardless of any subtle adjustments
14 in the square footage we would not achieve
15 anywhere near the maximum square footage
16 allowable.
17 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Now, just
18 finishing up on housing, does the
19 application as proposed for a preliminary
20 planned development approval comply with
21 the township's affordable housing
22 regulations?
23 MS. STAINES: The planned
24 development will comply with the township's
25 affordability requirements, yes.
1 MR. KIENZ: Now, this is in
2 Section 23-10B.4, specifically a, and it's
3 on Page 2394.8?
5 MR. KIENZ: Which was revised as
6 of June 1998. Is that correct?
7 MS. STAINES: Yes. That's correct.
8 MR. KIENZ: Now, there is a
9 mandatory set-aside under this section, is
10 there not?
11 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
12 MR. KIENZ: And that set aside is
13 what?
14 MS. STAINES: The set-aside is 20
15 percent of the residential units, as well
16 as a cash contribution, which is some
17 proportion that is approved by the board in
18 relation to the nonresidential use.
19 MR. KIENZ: And we would meet
20 that requirement for the residential uses,
21 which is the ten percent plus an additional
22 ten percent. Is that correct?
23 MS. STAINES: The ordinance makes
24 allowance that there is a requirement the
25 development must provide at least ten of
1 the 20 percent on-site. The balance may be
2 constructed on site or may, at the
3 discretion of the board, be distributed
4 throughout the community.
5 MR. KIENZ: Okay. I want to
6 finish up the affordable -- there is also a
7 section for nonresidential development --
9 MR. KIENZ: -- under that?
10 MS. STAINES: Yes.
11 I think I skipped ahead.
12 MR. KIENZ: And that Section
13 23-10B.4(b) --
14 MS. STAINES: Yes.
15 MR. KIENZ: -- that requires a
16 developer of any new nonresidential project
17 containing in excess of 50,000 square feet
18 shall have an obligation to contribute to
19 the housing trust fund as set forth in an
20 additional section of this ordinance?
21 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
22 MR. KIENZ: Are you -- are we
23 going to comply with that?
24 MS. STAINES: The applicant will
25 comply.
1 MR. KIENZ: Now, there are also
2 special requirements for planned unit
3 developments. Is that correct?
4 MS. STAINES: I beg your pardon?
5 MR. KIENZ: In Subsection C on
6 Page 2394.9 --
8 MR. KIENZ: -- we are going to
9 also comply with that as deemed necessary
10 and appropriate by the hearing board that
11 has jurisdiction in this area?
12 MS. STAINES: Yes. Certainly. And
13 that relates to the provision of a portion
14 of residential units to a portion of
15 nonresidential.
16 MR. KIENZ: Okay. That's
17 something that you were going to work out
18 with the planning board or the appropriate
19 authorities as designated by ordinance in
20 the municipality. Is that correct?
21 MS. STAINES: Yes. That's correct.
22 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Let's turn
23 back now into the zoning section of the
24 ordinance.
25 Are we proposing to construct a
1 hotel on the site?
2 MR. DUNN: What page?
3 MR. KIENZ: I am sorry.
4 Now we are back up at Page 2373.
5 For the record it's Section 23-10.4(c), and
6 I am referring to Section c.1 and
7 specifically (b).
8 Are we proposing to construct a
9 hotel on-site?
10 MS. STAINES: It's actually a hotel
11 conference facility, yes.
12 MR. KIENZ: And where is that,
13 Laura? Would you please show it.
14 MS. STAINES: Certainly.
15 That's located to the north of the
16 cove adjoining West New York along the
17 waterfront.
18 MR. KIENZ: Are we also proposing
19 a ferry terminal?
20 MS. STAINES: Yes, we are.
21 We are relocating the existing ferry
22 terminal also to a location with the -- at
23 the cove.
24 MR. KIENZ: Is that a permitted
25 use?
1 MS. STAINES: It's a permited
2 accessory use, not a permitted principal
3 use.
4 MR. SEGRETO: Say it again.
5 MS. STAINES: It's a permitted
6 accessory use on Page 3375.
7 MR. KIENZ: Would you describe
8 the ferry terminal.
9 MS. STAINES: We started from the
10 hotel conference facility, which is
11 immediately to the north of the ferry, to
12 the west of that building is a large office
13 building with retail along its front facade
14 and containing five levels of structured
15 parking.
16 To the immediate west of the ferry
17 terminal are twin office buildings, which
18 rise above a four- and five-story parking
19 structure. The parking structures of both
20 the westerly, the northerly building, that
21 is, and the central building are designed
22 to support the surrounding uses, as well as
23 the ferry terminal itself.
24 The building to the immediate south
25 of the ferry terminal is a stand-alone
1 office building whose parking is in the
2 adjoining building to the south of it.
3 These are high-intensity office
4 uses.
5 MR. KIENZ: Okay. What's that
6 yellow line kind of going over the road,
7 what is that?
8 MS. STAINES: I presume you mean
9 this one right here, the Conrail
10 right-of-way.
11 MR. KIENZ: Yes.
12 MS. STAINES: The light rail
13 station that is contemplated to be
14 constructed in this area needs to make
15 provision for the orderly transport of
16 pedestrians from the light rail station to
17 the ferry terminal.
18 We have proposed a walkway system
19 above Port Imperial Boulevard to provide
20 the safe transit. That walkway system will
21 also extend through a river-front promenade
22 and ultimately provide an aboveground, as
23 well as on-grade crossing, to the ferry
24 terminal itself.
25 MR. KIENZ: Finally, would you
1 describe the uses of the banana building
2 that are proposed.
3 MS. STAINES: Yes. The banana
4 building that we pointed out here to the
5 south of the site will contain offices,
6 which is an expansion of an existing office
7 for the benefit of the Arcorp development.
8 I believe that's approximately 30,000
9 square feet.
10 There is the proposal for the
11 banquet facility of 42,000 square feet to
12 be contained within the existing structure,
13 and to the north of the banquet facility
14 will be integrated a health care or health
15 club -- I beg your pardon -- and that will
16 contain approximately 98,000 square feet
17 inside the building, plus support
18 recreational facilities outside the
19 building.
20 MR. KIENZ: Laura, all the uses
21 that you proposed, are they permitted uses
22 in the zone, in your opinion?
23 MS. STAINES: With the exception of
24 the ferry and the parking, they are all
25 permitted principal uses.
1 The ferry and all the structured
2 parking on the site are permitted accessory
3 uses.
4 MR. KIENZ: Okay. I want to turn
5 your attention also, though, to the section
6 of the ordinance, which is 23-10.4C,
7 Subparagraph (g), which is on Page 2374.
9 MR. KIENZ: That section says,
10 "Any other use which the planning board, in
11 connection with the approval of the planned
12 development, specifically determines by
13 resolution to be consistent with the
14 standards of the Planned Development
15 District." Is that correct?
16 MS. STAINES: Yes. That's correct.
17 MR. KIENZ: That section, in your
18 opinion, what does that section mean, the
19 planning board can do for uses in this
20 zone?
21 MS. STAINES: If the planning board
22 determines that the uses proposed are
23 consistent and beneficial to the permitted
24 uses that, by extension, those are
25 permitted uses.
1 MR. KIENZ: I am sorry. Could
2 you repeat that. You lost me.
3 MS. STAINES: Yes. The planning
4 board in their determination that a
5 proposed use is beneficial to and to be
6 utilized by other existing uses may by
7 extension grant approval to that use.
8 MR. KIENZ: So the planning board
9 -- what you are saying, the planning board
10 could look at a use, and even if it were
11 not specifically mentioned, the planning
12 board has the authority under the planned
13 development section of the ordinance to
14 say, "You are right, that use should go in
15 this zone"?
16 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
17 MR. KIENZ: Okay. I think it's
18 time now to have -- I would like to talk
19 about the objectives of the land use
20 ordinance.
21 I think I would like to have Michael
22 provide some testimony on that.
23 MR. DUNN: We started this at
24 7:20, and it's now 8:10. Why don't we take
25 a break, Mr. Chairman.
1 MR. GOULD: Let's take a short
2 break for five minutes.
3 (Whereupon, a short recess is
4 taken.)
5 MR. GOULD: Okay. Can everybody
6 please sit. I think you can stay down
7 there.
8 What time is it?
9 Okay, everybody, it's 8:25.
10 Mr. Kienz, are you ready to proceed?
11 MR. KIENZ: Absolutely, Mr.
12 Chairman.
13 MR. GOULD: Hold on one second.
14 Let's take a roll call, first.
15 THE CLERK: Anthony Rosas.
16 MR. ROSAS: Yes.
17 THE CLERK: Mr. Barsa.
18 MR. BARSA: Yes.
19 THE CLERK: Mr. Turner.
20 MR. TURNER: Here.
21 THE CLERK: Mr. Gould.
22 MR. GOULD: Here.
23 THE CLERK: Mr. Cabrera.
24 MR. CABRERA: Here.
25 THE CLERK: Ms. Kravitz.
1 MS. KRAVITZ: Here.
2 MR. GOULD: Okay.
3 All right. Mr. Kienz, would you
4 like to continue?
5 MR. KIENZ: Yes.
6 We have a few more questions to
7 cover on one more section with a couple of
8 more footnotes in it.
9 I want to indicate we are trying our
10 best, as I think the board probably
11 realizes, to track your ordinance in
12 somewhat of a coherent fashion, because
13 there are different sections of the
14 ordinance that kind of cross over, so if
15 you will just bear with me. That's why I
16 am trying to take the time to refer to the
17 section and even the page number, so what
18 we are referring to now is Section 23-10.1,
19 which are the purposes and objectives of
20 the ordinance, and that's on Page 2369.
21 Let me just read it into the record,
22 it says, "The following are the objectives
23 of the township in permitting planned
24 developments pursuant to the authority
25 granted by the Municipal Land Use Law."
1 Now, Laura, we are going to go right
2 down these. I am going to read them, and I
3 am going to ask you some questions on each
4 section.
5 "a" says that one of the purposes
6 and objectives is "To provide for
7 well-located, clean, safe and pleasant
8 sites for industrial, office, commercial
9 and recreation purposes and a high-quality
10 environment for the people who live, work
11 and visit there."
12 Do we address that purpose and
13 objective?
14 MS. STAINES: Yes, we have.
15 MR. KIENZ: How do we do that on
16 this plan?
17 MS. STAINES: Certainly we have
18 been blessed with an extraordinary
19 location.
20 As far as the provision of the safe,
21 clean and pleasant surroundings, our plan
22 is to remediate a brownfield site, which
23 will render the site safe for development
24 and also enhance the balance of the
25 existing portion of Weehawken because of
1 the proximity to this section and ability
2 to attract new businesses and uses.
3 The fact that we are proposing a
4 mixed use also deals with the objectives of
5 the provision of offices, commercial,
6 recreational and high-quality environments.
7 We have also anticipated providing
8 or we propose a significant amount of open
9 space.
10 MR. KIENZ: I am going to ask you
11 to keep your voice up. You are kind of
12 fading a little bit.
13 MS. STAINES: I am sorry.
14 MR. KIENZ: That's okay.
15 So this will be an environment where
16 people will be able to live, work, and
17 visit. That's one of the specific
18 standards and goals or purposes and
19 objectives? I am sorry.
20 MS. STAINES: Yes. That's correct.
21 And, also, we have taken into
22 consideration, as I have testified earlier,
23 the integration of the mixed-use spaces
24 will allow for a 24-hour community, which
25 will create a very viable and vibrant
1 neighborhood and provide for the safety,
2 not only for residents, but also for the
3 public when visiting the site because the
4 site will be in operation 24 hours a day.
5 MR. KIENZ: Laura, the second
6 purpose and objective is "To encourage
7 innovations in residential, commercial,
8 industrial and cultural development which
9 will conserve open space and provide
10 greater variety of land uses and the type,
11 design and layout of buildings."
12 Would you please address that.
13 MS. STAINES: Yes. Certainly.
14 The development of the individual
15 buildings within various components, with
16 the exception of the brownstones and one
17 building that is exclusively office, the
18 rest of the buildings proposed are
19 combinations of uses, whether they be
20 combinations of commercial, retail,
21 residential, retail, residential and
22 office, these are all on the planned
23 development to provide an atmosphere that
24 encourages the growth and benefits the
25 residents of the community.
1 The fact that the primary uses are
2 consolidated in one central section of the
3 site, in close proximity to significant
4 intermodal transportation elements, means
5 that a significant portion of the site to
6 the opposing end of our planned development
7 zone may be retained as large tracts of
8 open space for the benefit of all the
9 businesses.
10 MR. KIENZ: Let's talk about the
11 intermodal elements of transportation.
12 Could you describe them a little
13 bit, please.
14 MS. STAINES: We propose quite a
15 variety.
16 First of all, the proposal from the
17 New Jersey Department of Transportation is
18 the extension of the light rail line, which
19 will provide service actually within the
20 confines of the planned development
21 district, and, as I testified earlier,
22 there will be stations planned for the
23 right-of-way on the westerly side of Port
24 Imperial Boulevard.
25 MR. KIENZ: That light rail line
1 is running from where to where? Do you
2 have any idea?
3 MS. STAINES: I recall the end
4 point is Bayonne. To be candid, I don't
5 recall the beginning point. I know it's --
6 it services large parts of Hudson and
7 Bergen Counties.
8 MR. KIENZ: What other components
9 make up this intermodal transportation
10 link?
11 MS. STAINES: As I pointed out,
12 there are a number of sources.
13 Port Imperial Boulevard will provide
14 the service for automobiles and buses that
15 will be picking up and dropping off patrons
16 of both the light rail and the ferry
17 terminal.
18 The ferry terminal itself will be an
19 opportunity for the residents and the
20 workers within the community to access
21 Manhattan or individuals from Manhattan,
22 that is, to access places of employment
23 within the community.
24 MR. KIENZ: Now, that ferry
25 terminal already exists, does it not?
1 MS. STAINES: The existing ferry
2 terminal is located to the south of the
3 proposed relocation, but it is an existing
4 use.
5 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Could you
6 describe -- who is using it right now?
7 MS. STAINES: Well, right now the
8 ferry terminal is providing transportation
9 opportunities for the residents of the
10 existing planned community, which is
11 located to the immediate south.
12 I testified earlier Hartz Mountain
13 has developed a sizable community of
14 office, retail, hotel and residential uses,
15 including Riva Point and -- I am sorry --
16 the name escapes me -- as I pointed out, a
17 very sizable community.
18 In addition, there is a significant
19 number of residents of Weehawken itself who
20 may also utilize the services of the ferry
21 terminal.
22 However, we anticipate the expansion
23 of that ferry terminal because the
24 provision of the office, retail and
25 residential uses that are currently
1 proposed for the planned development will
2 require additional ferry services.
3 MR. KIENZ: Now, are there going
4 to be links to the ferry terminal also?
5 Are there shuttles going along this whole
6 area in the planned development along the
7 waterfront? Are they going to be linked to
8 the ferry terminal?
9 MS. STAINES: We actually propose a
10 variety of links, and that's why I keep
11 referring to it as intermodal. It's not
12 one or two elements, but a considerable
13 variety, not only to provide choice to the
14 residents, but the alternatives are
15 beneficial to all.
16 The buses, as I pointed out, will
17 provide access. The internal roadways, we
18 anticipate, will be limited in their
19 automobile use.
20 We would propose, instead, the
21 utilization of the pedestrian walkways and,
22 very significantly, our own internal jitney
23 service to provide access throughout the
24 planned development district.
25 MR. KIENZ: Is there anything you
1 want to say about the intermodal rings and
2 the ferry terminal?
4 Actually, one of the key
5 characteristics of the provision of this
6 integrated transportation element is the
7 fact that we anticipate a significant
8 reduction in the dependency on the
9 automobile, which has a lot to do with the
10 planning design of this community.
11 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Let's turn now
12 again back to the regulations and purposes
13 of -- and objectives for planned
14 development, and I believe we are up to C,
15 which as an objective and purpose says, "To
16 provide for high-quality residential
17 development of the waterfront to reinforce
18 and enliven other developments"?
19 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
20 I did testify earlier, we anticipate
21 a variety of housing types as well, from
22 the luxury brownstone buildings, with a
23 significant value, to a variety of housing
24 options, including senior housing or
25 retirement housing, rental communities for
1 young adults, town home communities for
2 individuals who prefer the life style
3 living in this particular waterfront
4 community and having access to all the
5 amenities afforded by proximity to
6 Manhattan.
7 These individuals will be -- we
8 anticipate will not only demand
9 high-quality housing, they will also demand
10 and enjoy the high quality of retail and
11 other services that we would be providing
12 and --
13 MR. KIENZ: The next criteria is
14 "To encourage preservation of the beauty of
15 recognized topographical features; namely,
16 the face of the Palisades; and to preserve
17 public enjoyment of the view from the top
18 of the Palisades."
19 How are we meeting that purpose and
20 objective?
21 MS. STAINES: Again, although it
22 seems as though I am repeating myself, the
23 Palisades has been retained in its entirety
24 with no development, and this is the area
25 to the west of the Conrail right-of-way, as
1 well as to the area north of the extension
2 of 48th Street to the west of the
3 right-of-way for Port Imperial Boulevard.
4 MR. KIENZ: We are going to have
5 some more testimony on actually the view
6 corridors later. Is that correct?
7 MS. STAINES: I was just going to
8 point that out.
9 There is a significant series of
10 requirements that are imposed by the
11 ordinance, and there will be considerable
12 testimony in a much more consolidated
13 fashion where we will address that issue.
14 MR. KIENZ: The next criteria "To
15 provide public access to and beautification
16 of the Hudson River waterfront."
17 MS. STAINES: We obtained a number
18 of opportunities to do that.
19 As I pointed out earlier, the
20 provision of the mandated waterfront
21 walkway along the river front itself is
22 significant.
23 MR. WEIR: Plate 206.
24 MS. STAINES: This particular slide
25 is representative of the quality and the
1 expected design of the extension of the
2 waterfront walkway. This particular
3 portion exists in Port Imperial North, in
4 West New York, and the applicant will be
5 responsible for the ultimate provision of
6 all the aspects of the waterfront walkway,
7 and each of these elements of the walkway
8 will be constructed as representative
9 phases of the development are under way.
10 As you can see, we have not only
11 maintained a sizable walkway to the
12 requirements mandated by DEP and the
13 Township of Weehawken, but we have enhanced
14 the walkway with significant architectural
15 landscape elements, including significant
16 landscaping, and as the community proceeds,
17 you will see this will be an integrated
18 walkway throughout the community.
19 Steve, may I go back to the site
20 plan for a moment.
21 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
22 MS. STAINES: It may be of interest
23 to both the board and the public to note if
24 you proceed and add up the entire length of
25 the waterfront walkway throughout the
1 entire site, we are in excess of 7,000
2 lineal feet of walkway, which was well over
3 a mile, so this particular community will
4 provide uninterrupted access to the
5 waterfront by pedestrians.
6 MR. KIENZ: Laura, how are we
7 going to encourage more efficient use of
8 land and public services or public services
9 in lieu thereof?
10 MS. STAINES: Well, one of those
11 ways, which I had discussed earlier, is the
12 fact that we have concentrated elements of
13 the community in the mix-use community.
14 This not only promotes significant
15 pedestrian movement and the pedestrians in
16 turn become patrons of the retail and
17 patrons of the office space, but it also
18 consolidates the provision of public
19 services, because those public services do
20 not have to traverse the entire site. They
21 now can concentrate their efforts in
22 limited areas.
23 The site will be retained with
24 significant open-space parcels which will
25 require less maintenance.
1 MR. KIENZ: Are we also providing
2 for office, hotel, other commercial
3 recreational development which will aid in
4 strengthening the economic base of the
5 township?
6 MS. STAINES: Those are clear
7 elements of significant rateables and
8 should do quite a bit to boost the physical
9 health of the Township of Weehawken.
10 MR. KIENZ: That will be
11 testified to by Dr. Listokin also. Is that
12 correct?
13 MS. STAINES: Yes.
14 MR. KIENZ: Also promoting the
15 sound growth more or less and general
16 welfare of the township of Weehawken by
17 promoting this site?
18 MS. STAINES: Yes.
19 MR. KIENZ: What are we doing?
20 MS. STAINES: The most significant
21 -- and it bears repeating -- is the fact
22 that this an existing brownfield site, and
23 unless construction takes place, there is
24 no opportunity for remediation of the site.
25 MR. KIENZ: Are we promoting the
1 development and redevelopment of the Hudson
2 River waterfront area in a comprehensive
3 and orderly fashion?
4 MS. STAINES: Yes, we are.
5 MR. KIENZ: And are we doing that
6 because this is under a planned development
7 ordinance, this is a unified plan for the
8 entire site? Is that correct?
9 MS. STAINES: Well, quite frankly,
10 that's a significant asset, because of the
11 PD overlay zone, we are able to scrutinize
12 the site in its entirety and locate
13 buildings for their best utilization of the
14 site, as opposed to the strict dictates of
15 an underlying --
16 MR. KIENZ: Also promoting the
17 development and redevelopment of the
18 affordable housing to all housing?
19 MS. STAINES: Yes, we are.
20 MR. KIENZ: You did not testify
21 to that earlier in the evening.
22 MS. STAINES: Yes.
23 MR. KIENZ: Meeting that purpose
24 and goal of the objective also?
25 MS. STAINES: Please repeat that.
1 MR. KIENZ: We are meeting that
2 purpose and objective also?
3 MS. STAINES: Yes, we are.
4 MR. KIENZ: Finally, are we
5 encouraging development of an
6 infrastructure that is integrally related
7 to the infrastructure of the region?
8 MS. STAINES: Yes, we are.
9 MR. KIENZ: And that was
10 testified to by Mr. Lanza. Is that
11 correct?
12 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
13 MR. KIENZ: All right. Laura, I
14 may have just hurried through one thing --
15 and I apologize to the board for that -- I
16 would like to go back and just review the
17 floor area numbers that you had.
18 MS. STAINES: I was wondering when
19 that was coming back, yes.
20 MR. KIENZ: I noticed that when I
21 had the five-minute break.
22 MS. STAINES: We had spoken of the
23 residential and, quite frankly, I allowed
24 that to skip by.
25 MR. WEIR: Plate 256.
1 MS. STAINES: Thank you very much.
2 Because I, in fact, described the
3 balance of the uses and neglected to
4 describe the overall square footage.
5 MR. KIENZ: Okay. What is this?
6 MS. HARTMANN: What plate is that?
7 MR. WEIR: 256.
8 MR. KIENZ: What does this show,
9 Laura?
10 MS. STAINES: The upper portion of
11 this slide represents the various uses that
12 are proposed on the site and their
13 respective proposed square footages as they
14 relate to the allowable FAR or floor area
15 ratio for the entire planned development.
16 MR. KIENZ: What requirement do
17 we have to show as a requirement of the
18 ordinance?
19 MS. STAINES: Well, the ordinance
20 itself makes allowances for the amount of
21 square footage of development, meaning that
22 an office use has a particular size.
23 The size of office, retail,
24 residential units, hotel, et cetera, must
25 be totaled, and that total must not exceed
1 the extreme total that is allowed per the
2 ordinance, and there is a calculation that
3 will provide that specific number, and, I
4 believe, there is another slide, Steve, the
5 next one.
6 MR. WEIR: Plate 224.
7 MS. STAINES: It might be good for
8 me --
9 MR. SEGRETO: May I interrupt for a
10 moment?
11 Mr. Chairman, we are now getting
12 some graphics, which are very fact
13 intensive.
14 Is it my understanding of the
15 procedure that counsel will furnish me with
16 hard copies of these graphics?
17 MR. DUNN: Counsel has -- I know
18 counsel has provided it. I understand that
19 they are in the notebook that was marked
20 one of the very first exhibits.
21 Am I correct, Mr. Kienz?
22 MR. SEGRETO: A notebook that I
23 have that was given to me doesn't include
24 these graphics.
25 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Dunn --
1 MR. DUNN: I am sorry.
2 MR. KIENZ: -- that's quite all
3 right. That's quite all right.
4 I just want to get my tabs and make
5 sure we mark it appropriately.
6 MR. SEGRETO: The notebook that I
7 recall having seen --
8 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Segreto, I am
9 going to take care of it --
10 MR. DUNN: It's a new notebook.
11 MR. KIENZ: -- I promise.
12 MR. SEGRETO: There is a new
13 notebook?
14 MR. KIENZ: I promise.
15 MR. DUNN: Hold on.
16 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Chairman, it's my
17 impression that we are up to Exhibit A-13.
18 I will stand corrected. I had this
19 premarked. That's the next one on my
20 sheet.
21 MR. DUNN: Let me see. I have A
22 -- mark them A-14
23 MR. KIENZ: I thought I was going
24 to mark these A-13.
25 I will go to A-14 if you say it's
1 the right number, Tom.
2 MR. DUNN: I have A-13 for
3 Elizabeth McLoughlin.
4 (Port Imperial South Planning Board
5 Presentation, December 9, 1999, is marked
6 as Exhibit A-13 for identification.)
7 MR. KIENZ: Okay. That's fine.
8 For the record, I have marked one as
9 A-14, and for the record it can be
10 identified as Port Imperial South Planning
11 Board Presentation, December 9, 1999, and
12 for the record, let it be shown I am
13 handing Mr. Segreto the first one.
14 MR. SEGRETO: This is A what?
15 MR. KIENZ: A-14.
16 MR. GOULD: 14.
17 MR. SEGRETO: May we make an
18 observation on the record?
19 Needless to say presenting me with
20 this exhibit at a quarter to nine this
21 evening, which is filled with very
22 important datum page after page, yield
23 parking count charts, et cetera, et cetera,
24 hardly gives me an opportunity to be able
25 to read it so that I can ask meaningful
1 questions of this witness concerning the
2 factual contents.
3 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Segreto, let me
4 help you.
5 MR. SEGRETO: I would expect that I
6 will be given an opportunity at a
7 subsequent meeting to cross-examine her in
8 connection with this documentation which I
9 just have.
10 MR. DUNN: Do you have a comment
11 to that, Mr. Kienz?
12 MR. KIENZ: Yes.
13 This is part of a book that was
14 marked December 2nd that, I believe, was
15 made part of the record -- I am sorry -- it
16 was marked December 2nd.
17 It's Plate 223.
18 This is just common testimony. We
19 did this for the convenience of everyone.
20 This information is easily obtainable.
21 It's on the plans. There is no mystery to
22 it.
23 Laura is going to explain how she
24 did the calculation, and I am sure counsel
25 will figure it out rather quickly that it
1 is a simple matter.
2 MR. DUNN: Let's not ascribe
3 motives or thoughts of Mr. Segreto.
4 I am a little bit confused right
5 now, because what's been marked as A-14 for
6 identification doesn't contain Plate 256.
7 Am I missing it? The document that I have,
8 the plates begin with 257.
9 MR. SEGRETO: The one that's up now
10 is which?
11 MR. DUNN: 256.
12 MR. WEIR: 256.
13 MR. SEGRETO: That means that 255
14 is not in here either.
15 Could we go back to 255?
16 MR. DUNN: Let's keep it
17 orderly.
18 I want to make sure what was handed
19 to me contains 256, and unless it had been
20 marked previously --
21 MR. KIENZ: Can we go off the
22 record for a minute, please?
23 MR. GOULD: Off the record.
24 (Whereupon, a discussion takes place
25 off the stenographic record.)
1 MR. GOULD: We will now go back
2 on the record.
3 MR. SEGRETO: We have colloquy
4 going on, and it's not on the record. I
5 may have to order the tape.
6 I don't want to lose my temper. I
7 understand the process. We are required
8 that every colloquy in the presence of this
9 board must be on this record, and we are
10 talking about something that is very
11 important now. We are talking about
12 documents.
13 MR. DUNN: We did not talk about
14 any documents off the record, so now, Mr.
15 Kienz, will you explain to us where
16 Document 256 and where Document 255 are.
17 MR. KIENZ: Yes, sir. And --
18 MR. DUNN: I am going to
19 instruct the reporter not to again honor
20 anyone's request to go off the record.
21 MR. KIENZ: On the record last
22 time -- I apologize to both counsel. I was
23 trying to make it easy. I failed.
24 Last time I was set to introduce a
25 notebook. We never got to it.
1 It's dated "Planning Board
2 Presentation, December 2, 1999."
3 I would like to admit that now
4 because that's part of it, and that will
5 complete all of the binders that everyone
6 has.
7 MR. DUNN: All right.
8 MR. SEGRETO: When you say you are
9 going to "admit it," you are going to move
10 it into evidence?
11 MR. DUNN: He asked to have it
12 marked.
13 MR. SEGRETO: As an exhibit
14 MR. DUNN: As Exhibit A-9. Is
15 that right?
16 MR. KIENZ: Yes, Mr. Dunn.
17 MR. DUNN: What is that
18 entitled?
19 MR. KIENZ: "Port Imperial South,
20 LLC, Planning Board Presentation, December
21 2, 1999," and I apologize. I would take
22 responsibility for that myself.
23 (Port Imperial South, LLC, Planning
24 Board Presentation, December 2, 199, is
25 marked as Exhibit A-9 for identification.)
1 MR. KIENZ: Okay.
2 MR. SEGRETO: Do I have that one?
3 Is that the one that I have?
4 MR. KIENZ: You will in a second.
5 MR. SEGRETO: Oh, I will.
6 MR. DUNN: Okay.
7 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Dunn, here is
8 A-9.
9 MR. DUNN: Will you hand a copy
10 to Mr. Segreto, please.
11 MR. KIENZ: Of course.
12 MR. SEGRETO: This is A what?
13 MR. KIENZ: A-9.
14 MR. SEGRETO: A-9.
15 MR. GOULD: Tom, should --
16 MR. SEGRETO: I do want the record
17 to reflect that in my quick perusal of A-9,
18 the two graphics that counsel for the board
19 asked about -- where are they -- don't
20 appear to be in this one either, or have I
21 missed something?
22 MS. STAINES: I would like to --
23 MR. GOULD: I am sorry.
24 MS. STAINES: I would like to draw
25 attention to Plates 224 and 225, I believe,
1 Steve, perhaps, will you be so kind.
2 MR. ROSAS: Section 5.
3 MS. STAINES: 224 and 225. You may
4 want to correct the templet.
5 MR. SEGRETO: Those are master plan
6 -- I am looking at A-9, and the back of
7 mine -- the last page of mine is Plate 256,
8 which is the Master Plan Amendment
9 excerpts.
10 MS. STAINES: I believe I referred
11 --
12 MR. SEGRETO: Where is the one
13 that's up to --
14 MS. STAINES: Plates 224, 225.
15 MR. DUNN: Let's ask -- I am
16 aware -- may I, Mr. Segreto? I am aware
17 what graphic --
18 MR. WEIR: According to our bar
19 code, the permited use chart was 256. The
20 one that's up there now will be 224.
21 MR. SEGRETO: Come on.
22 MR. GOULD: In the book they are
23 labeled as 223 and 224.
24 MR. WEIR: There is a Plate 223.
25 MR. ROSAS: Section 5.
1 MR. GOULD: I am sorry. 224 and
2 225. Sorry.
3 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
4 For the purposes of the testimony, I
5 will be happy to also refer to the titles
6 so there is no misconception.
7 MR. SEGRETO: Okay. I have that
8 one.
9 MR. KIENZ: Let's make sure that
10 everybody is literally on the same page.
11 MS. STAINES: On the same page.
12 All right. I am going to refer to
13 the book that's dated December 2, 1999.
14 I go to Tab 5, and the second and
15 third pages, which are respectively Plates
16 224 and 225, are the subject of the
17 testimony I am about to give.
18 MR. GOULD: Can I interrupt?
19 Before you start, are you also going
20 to give us copies of this book for the
21 board's consultants?
22 MR. KIENZ: Yes. We will get
23 more copies.
24 MR. GOULD: Thank you.
25 MR. DUNN: And, again, Mr. Weir,
1 what number is on the screen?
2 MR. WEIR: On the bar code it's
3 256. It appears it is 225.
4 MS. STAINES: It is 224.
5 MR. WEIR: 224 is the correct
6 number.
7 MR. SEGRETO: Now, Mr. Chairman,
8 respectfully, may I have a determination
9 from the Chair as to whether or not my
10 request that I have already put on the
11 record, about an opportunity to digest this
12 fact-intensive information that I just got
13 so that I can examine the witness
14 concerning it at a subsequent meeting?
15 MR. DUNN: At the rate we are
16 going I rather doubt whether we will finish
17 your cross-examination tonight.
18 MR. SEGRETO: I believe that.
19 MR. DUNN: So you will have an
20 opportunity over the next week to examine
21 the document to continue your
22 cross-examination.
23 MR. SEGRETO: Unless some miracle
24 happens where we are finished.
25 MR. DUNN: Something like
1 waiving cross-examination. All right.
2 MR. SEGRETO: Counsel, I am not a
3 good waiver.
4 MR. KIENZ: Does this go on my
5 clock, Mr. Chairman?
6 Laura, would you please explain
7 what's up on the screen.
9 What we are looking at here is the
10 total project overview, and it's actually
11 an excerpt from the ordinance to which we
12 have applied the acreage in our PD.
13 The total project area, as I
14 previously testified to, is 204.37 acres,
15 multiplied by the square footage allocation
16 per acre yields in excess of 8.9 million
17 square feet of space. That is the total
18 project area inclusive of all waters and
19 land areas.
20 The water area alone represents
21 111.97 acres or 4,877,413.2 square feet,
22 which is in excess of your percent of the
23 overall PD district -- PD application --
24 pardon me -- the total project land area
25 contains 92.40 acres or 4,024,944 square
1 feet, approximately 45 percent of the area.
2 The ordinance allows for florr area
3 or square footage of total use on the site
4 to comply with the formulas prescribed in
5 Section -- hold on -- it would be Page 2379
6 of the current ordinance, and because of
7 all the various chapters and stuff, and, of
8 course, we referred to, it's Subparagraph F
9 under "Floor Area," what this allows is
10 that the total land area of 204 acres has a
11 factor of point two five applied to it, so
12 the 8.9 million square feet multiplied by
13 point two five will generate the
14 opportunity to develop on the site a
15 combination of uses that total 2,225,589.3
16 square feet.
17 In addition, the land area, which
18 was represented as 92.4 acres, has an
19 additional factor applied against it of
20 point six.
21 The mathematical equation, we take
22 the square footage that equals the 92.4,
23 which is, in fact, 4,024,944 square feet,
24 multiplied by the factor of point six,
25 generates an additional 2,414,966.4 square
1 feet.
2 The combination of those two
3 numbers, I have represented at the bottom
4 of the page, allows for a total development
5 without applying any incentive, which are
6 allowed in the ordinance.
7 We have not anticipated the
8 utilization of any incentive. The base FAR
9 allowed is 4,640,555.7 square feet.
10 The slide --
11 MR. GOULD: Hold on, please.
12 Okay.
13 MS. STAINES: Thank you.
14 If we move to 225 for a moment, I
15 will explain how that applies.
16 MR. WEIR: Plate 225.
17 MS. STAINES: We have previously
18 seen this up on the screen when I was
19 referring to the square footage of the
20 residential use on the site, if the board
21 might recall. I will be happy to revisit
22 the subject.
23 The way that we generated the square
24 footage from the residential use was to
25 examine the various proposed residential
1 uses allowed square footages for each
2 respective use and multiplied that square
3 footage by the respective number of units
4 in each of those categories.
5 For example, the brownstones were in
6 excess of 3,000 square feet of livable --
7 buildable area, 48 homes proposed.
8 We multiply the 48 units by the
9 3,000 square feet, and that gave us a
10 number, to which we added the square
11 footage for the senior housing community,
12 the respective additional town houses and
13 apartment community, the balance of the
14 apartment community.
15 Likewise, we have provided similar
16 calculations for the proposed office use.
17 This use also includes the proposed
18 expansion of the office within the banana
19 building, the retail uses on the site -- I
20 am sorry -- I will go back -- the office
21 use is proposed at 1,324,800 square feet.
22 We have proposed 156,000 square feet
23 of retail.
24 The restaurant is the existing
25 Arthur's Landing Restaurant, which is
1 approximately 6,000 square feet.
2 The health club to be located within
3 the banana building will contain
4 approximately 98,000 square feet of space.
5 The adjoining banquet facilities are
6 proposed at 42,000 square feet. The hotel
7 conference facility, which includes both
8 the convention elements, the lobby,
9 recreational portion and all the sleeping
10 rooms, will contain 320,820 square feet.
11 The total of all those square
12 footages, and it must be also stated that
13 none of these square footages include the
14 associated structured parking. As per the
15 ordinance, no structured parking is
16 included in this particular FAR
17 calculation.
18 Therefore, the total of the proposed
19 principal uses on the site is 3,827,840
20 square feet.
21 If I might refer back to the
22 previous slide, 224, Steve, you will see
23 where this number is very important.
24 MR. WEIR: Plate 224.
25 MS. STAINES: At the very bottom we
1 have an FAR or floor area proposed. There
2 again you see the same number, 3.8 million,
3 actually, 3,827,040 square feet, opposed to
4 the FAR, which would have been allowed
5 without the incentives, of 4,640,555.70
6 square feet, and we are developing only
7 82.49 percent of our potential.
8 MR. KIENZ: Laura, this satisfies
9 the requirements of the proof under Section
10 22-8.8b on Page 2242 of the ordinance. Is
11 that correct?
12 MR. SEGRETO: What page?
13 MS. STAINES: Please refer to that
14 page again, 22 --
15 MR. KIENZ: Of course.
16 Page 2242.
17 The section, though, for the record,
18 is 22-8.8b, which requires that calculation
19 to be done.
20 It's Page 2242.
21 MS. STAINES: Okay. Would you
22 please direct me to the paragraph you are
23 referring to.
24 MR. KIENZ: Paragraph "b" at the
25 top of the page.
1 MS. STAINES: Oh, yes.
2 That is correct. These are the
3 calculations of the specific square
4 footages, and in order to facilitate the
5 percentages of areas that refer back -- we
6 will refer back to Slide 225 for a moment.
7 I apologize going back and forth,
8 but there is so much information. In order
9 to make it clear to the board, it was
10 important that we provide them in two
11 separate slides.
12 This particular calculation refers
13 back to the square footages that I just
14 testified to, and, as you can see, in all
15 the various categories, the respective
16 percentages, as it relates to the
17 alternative or the additional use, that is,
18 has been calculated against total project
19 area, land area and total developed square
20 footage.
21 MR. KIENZ: Do you have anything
22 else, Laura?
24 MR. KIENZ: Michael, I would like
25 to turn your attention to Section 23-10.4
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 on Page 2370 of the ordinance.
2 MR. SEGRETO: Mr. Dunn, for the
3 purpose of your calculation of time, are
4 you adding these together or are you
5 calculating them separately?
6 MR. DUNN: Do you have a
7 preference?
8 MR. SEGRETO: All I want to know
9 are the ground rules.
10 MR. DUNN: The two witnesses
11 will be subject to cross-examination for
12 the entire length of time. I am not going
13 to break it down between the two.
14 MR. SEGRETO: My asking the
15 question doesn't suggest that I now think
16 that your arbitrary rule of two to one is
17 appropriate.
18 MR. DUNN: I understand. I
19 understand that you think the rule is
20 arbitrary, and I understand that you are
21 not waiving any rights by doing that.
22 M I C H A E L G I A R D I N O
24 Q Michael, Section 23-10.4 contains
25 "Criteria and Standards for Planned Development."
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 Are you also familiar with the zoning
2 ordinance, the development codes of Weehawken?
3 A Yes, sir, I am.
4 MR. WEIR: Plate 222.
5 Q Subsection A has a number of general
6 conditions.
7 The first requires that the "planned
8 development is" --
9 MR. SEGRETO: Forgive me.
10 Q -- "to the extent possible with due
11 consideration for differing land ownerships an
12 integral part of a general plan or plans for
13 development of the entire Planned Development
14 District."
15 Under a different section of the ordinance
16 Laura addressed that issue.
17 Would you please also address this issue
18 under this section of the ordinance.
19 MR. SEGRETO: May I have the name
20 of the -- of this gentleman, please.
21 MR. KIENZ: Michael, would you
22 state your name again for the record.
23 THE WITNESS: Michael David
24 Giardino.
25 MR. SEGRETO: G-i-a-r-d-i-n-o?
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 THE WITNESS: Correct.
2 Q Okay. Michael, could you tell --
3 please, Michael, could you please respond to my
4 question.
5 A Yes, Glenn, if I could just
6 interrupt for one second.
7 Technically, I think our laser pointer has
8 a problem.
9 Steve, do you have a spare laser pointer?
10 MR. SEGRETO: You need a laser
11 pointer?
12 MR. WEIR: Here you go. It
13 doesn't stay on. You have to hold it down.
14 MS. STAINES: I am not that
15 mechanical, but I did it.
16 MR. SEGRETO: This gentleman is
17 offered as a professional planner?
18 MR. KIENZ: That's what he was
19 qualified as; also, I believe, as an
20 architect at the time.
21 MR. SEGRETO: I understand. Is he
22 going to be testifying just on professional
23 planning or architectural also?
24 MR. KIENZ: Planning testimony as
25 required under the ordinance, sir.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 THE WITNESS: Mr. Kienz, in
2 response to your question, yes, this PD is
3 an integral part of the overall planned
4 development zone. In fact, looking at the
5 zoning map, Plate No. --
6 MR. WEIR: 222.
7 THE WITNESS: I will trace -- the
8 overall planned development district runs
9 the full length of the waterfront here in
10 Weehawken, and our site comprises roughly
11 two thirds of that area.
12 This dark line here represents the
13 borderline between our site and the site to
14 the south.
15 We are, in effect, the major piece
16 of the PD zone, and we are also factually
17 the remaining piece of the PD zone in which
18 development may occur as the southern
19 portion is developed.
20 Q Your opinion is that the proposed
21 planned development provides adequate means for
22 pedestrian access in the entire PD?
23 A Yes. We have taken great pains to
24 insure not only adequate pedestrian access, but we
25 feel superior pedestrian access.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 We have -- back to the overall plan,
2 please.
3 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
4 THE WITNESS: We have, as Laura
5 explained earlier, connected a continuous
6 waterfront walkway system in excess of a
7 mile in length with walkway systems to the
8 north and to the south of the site under
9 this plan. That is a principal water-use
10 access point for pedestrians.
11 We have the existing staircase
12 coming from upper Weehawken in this
13 vicinity here where Pershing Road makes a
14 sharp easterly turn. That will be an
15 enhanced connection with an improved
16 Pershing Road that will strengthen
17 pedestrian access directly down to our
18 three-quarter-acre park at the water.
19 Pershing Road itself is going to be
20 developed with a significant improvement of
21 pedestrian access to upper Weehawken up in
22 the restaurant area at Boulevard East, and
23 in addition to that, we have a proposal to
24 work with the town in the development of
25 the new stairway or other mode of
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 pedestrian connection in the area of Old
2 Glory Park.
3 Q In your opinion, does this provide
4 for an integration of the planned development with
5 other portions of the township as is required by
6 the ordinance?
7 A As a pedestrian integration, yes,
8 absolutely.
9 Q In your opinion, does the proposed
10 application permit and encourage -- I am sorry --
11 would you please give an opinion as to the
12 easement along our development and whether, in
13 your opinion, that also fosters the planned
14 development?
15 A I believe you are referring to the
16 waterfront walkway easement?
17 Q Yes, sir.
18 A The waterfront walkway easement will
19 run uninterrupted from the northern extreme of our
20 site to the southern extreme of our site, as
21 required by both the Weehawken and DEP
22 regulations.
23 That easement will be 30 feet in width for
24 its entire length with a minor exception in the
25 area of the existing banana building here where
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 the easement itself had been reduced to reflect
2 the existing constraints of that construction.
3 Q That's an existing situation, is it
4 not?
5 A Yes, it is.
6 Q And we certainly applied for relief
7 under that, but the banana building was the
8 subject of hearings before the zoning board of
9 adjustment, was it?
10 A Yes, it was.
11 Q The zoning board made an opinion --
12 MR. SEGRETO: I am going to try
13 once more and hope that counsel will
14 recognize that the last question is so
15 leading and even he wants to sustain my
16 objection at least on that one.
17 MR. DUNN: The objection is
18 sustained.
19 Q Are you familiar with the easement
20 in front of the banana building?
21 A Yes.
22 To the east of the banana building it's
23 between the building itself and the outside of the
24 existing pier structure.
25 Q How wide is that?
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
1 A That easement is somewhat less than
2 30 feet, my understanding. I haven't visited the
3 measurement myself. I understand it to be
4 somewhere in the vicinity of 26 to 28 feet.
5 Q Is that the subject of hearings
6 before the board of adjustment?
7 A My understanding.
8 Q Do you know what action they took
9 with regard to that easement?
10 A I do not.
11 MR. SEGRETO: Did you say the
12 easement is what, before the board of
13 adjustment?
14 MR. KIENZ: Do you want to read
15 back?
16 MR. SEGRETO: Yes, please.
17 MR. KIENZ: I would ask the board
18 to take judicial notice of resolutions that
19 it incorporated into its previous decision
20 from the sister board.
21 MR. SEGRETO: Are you talking about
22 in current hearings?
23 You said hearings which are before
24 the board of adjustment.
25 Is it something that's pending?
Giardino - Direct - Kienz

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