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WEEHAWKEN PLANNING BOARD HEARING
DECEMBER
9, 1999
FULL TRANSCRIPT
PAGES 1 TO 5
5

Witne
ss Laura Staines and Michael Giardino

Professional Planner & Architect
Direct Testimony

C
ross-Examination by the Planning Board

Below is the transcript from the Weehawken Planning Board Hearing on December
9th, 1999.  This html document follows the format of the official transcript. The transcript format has 25 lines per page. Each page is numbered. Because the transcript is so long, the file has been broken down into 4 different web pages.

Jump to 12/09/99 pages 56 to 110
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1 TOWNSHIP OF WEEHAWKEN PLANNING BOARD
2 THURSDAY, DECEMBER 9, 1999
        7:00 PM
3
4
        RE: PORT IMPERIAL SOUTH
5
6
        MEMBERS PRESENT:
7
8 MARK GOULD, Chairman
        RICHARD TURNER
9 ALBERT CABRERA
        CAROL KRAVITZ
10 RICHARD BARSA
        ANTHONY ROSAS
11 PILAR BARDROFF, Board Clerk
        ROBERT JURASIN, Town Engineer
12 JILL HARTMANN, Town Planner
13
14 ALSO PRESENT:
15
        BEATTIE, PADOVANO, ESQS.
16 BY: THOMAS W. DUNN, ESQ.
        Appearing on behalf of the Board.
17
        WEINER, LESNIAK, ESQ.
18 BY: GLENN C. KIENZ, ESQ.
        Appearing on behalf of the Applicant.
19
        SEGRETO & SEGRETO, ESQ.
20 BY: JAMES V. SEGRETO, ESQ.
        Attorney for the Objectors.
21
22
         PHILIP A. FISHMAN
23 COURT REPORTING AGENCY
        23 MARK TWAIN DRIVE
24 MORRISTOWN, NEW JERSEY 07960
        (973) 285-5331 - FAX (973) 285-5293
25
2
1 I N D E X
2 DIRECT CROSS REDIRECT RECROSS
3 WITNESS
4 LAURA STAINES
5 by Mr. Kienz 13 168
6 MICHAEL GIARDINO
7 by Mr. Kienz 103
8
9
10 I N D E X O F E X H I B I T S
11 EXHIBIT DESCRIPTION PAGE
12 A-13 Port Imperial South Planning
        Board Presentiation, December 9,
13 1999 87
14 A-9 Port Imperial South, LLC,
        Planning Board Presentation,
15 December 2, 1999 91
16 A-16 Proposed Development View
        Sections, 12/1/99 159
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
3
1 MR. GOULD: Okay. Hello to
2 everybody.
3 This is a regular public meeting of
4 the Weehawken Planning Board.
5 It has been called in accordance
6 with the Open Public Meetings Act of the
7 State of New Jersey in accordance with the
8 board's motion adopted on October 14, 1999.
9 We also have a letter from Donna
10 Jandik indicating that she faxed an agenda
11 of the meeting to the Bergen Record, the
12 Jersey Journal and the Weehawken Reporter,
13 posted it in the municipal building and
14 filed it with the township clerk.
15 Will the clerk please call the roll.
16 THE CLERK: Mr. Rosas.
17 MR. ROSAS: Here.
18 THE CLERK: Mr. Barsa.
19 MR. BARSA: Here.
20 THE CLERK: Mr. Turner.
21 MR. TURNER: Here.
22 THE CLERK: Mr. Gould.
23 MR. GOULD: Here.
24 THE CLERK: Ms. Kravitz.
25 MS. KRAVITZ: Here.
4
1 MR. GOULD: Okay. Thank you.
2 The first item on tonight's agenda
3 is the payment of bills.
4 I will pass out some -- please make
5 a note that Albert Cabrera has just
6 arrived. Let the record reflect that.
7 There are some bills to pass down --
8 MR. TURNER: Hold back his
9 paycheck.
10 MR. GOULD: -- bills for the
11 planning board dated December 9, 1999, a
12 total of $510.
13 Is there any discussion related to
14 this?
15 MR. TURNER: I will make a motion
16 to pay the bills.
17 MR. ROSAS: Second.
18 MR. GOULD: Seconded by Mr.
19 Rosas.
20 All right. Roll call, please.
21 THE CLERK: Mr. Rosas.
22 MR. ROSAS: Yes.
23 THE CLERK: Mr. Barsa.
24 MR. BARSA: Yes.
25 THE CLERK: Mr. Turner.
5
1 MR. TURNER: Yes.
2 THE CLERK: Mr. Gould.
3 MR. GOULD: Yes.
4 THE CLERK: Mr. Cabrera.
5 MR. CABRERA: Yes.
6 THE CLERK: Ms. Kravitz.
7 MS. KRAVITZ: Yes.
8 MR. GOULD: Okay. This is the
9 continued public hearing of a preliminary
10 planned development application for Block
11 36.05, Lot 1.01; Block 36.05, Lot 2.01;
12 Block 45, Lots 6, 7, 8 and 9; Block 45.01,
13 Lots point 01, 2.01, 3.01, and 4.01; Block
14 45.02, Lot 1.01; Block 64, Lots 8 and 9;
15 Block 64.01, Lots 1.01, 2.01, and 3.01;
16 Block 64.02, Lot 1.01; and Block 64.03, Lot
17 1.01.
18 The applicant is Port Imperial
19 South, LLC.
20 Okay. Mr. Kienz, are you ready to
21 proceed?
22 MR. KIENZ: Absolutely. I think
23 we are ready, Mr. Chairman.
24 Just a couple of things before we
25 get started.
6
1 Is there a hearing scheduled that
2 has been adopted by the board after the
3 month of December that's been put on the
4 record?
5 MR. DUNN: No, there has not
6 been, and that will be done at the meeting
7 of December 16th.
8 MR. KIENZ: Okay. The other
9 thing that I want to indicate is that
10 tonight, as I stated at the last meeting,
11 we have our planners here to testify from
12 the Martin Architectural Group.
13 They both have been sworn in. They
14 both have been accepted as experts at the
15 first meeting. It's Laura Staines and Mike
16 Giardino. They will be testifying.
17 What I would like to do, Mr.
18 Chairman, is, because of the nature of the
19 application, I want them both to be
20 testifying kind of at the same time. There
21 will be some overlaps. It will follow an
22 orderly process. I think it will help to
23 move the process along, because it will
24 just follow down in the ordinance. They
25 both worked in tandem. They both have
7
1 certain expertise in certain areas than
2 others.
3 MR. DUNN: Yes.
4 MR. SEGRETO: I object to that
5 process.
6 It's impossible for me to keep track
7 with two people talking simultaneously.
8 My cross-examination is going to be
9 as to each of the two planners, based upon
10 what each of them says, and it's irregular.
11 I have never heard of any judicial or any
12 planning board proceeding with two
13 witnesses are testifying simultaneously.
14 It's just unwieldy and is unfair and
15 an improper process.
16 MR. DUNN: Is your request that
17 they testify simultaneously or that they
18 testify in tandem?
19 MR. KIENZ: In tandem.
20 Ms. Staines will begin. She will
21 probably testify for the first half.
22 Mr. Giardino will testify then for
23 the next almost half, and then Laura will
24 wrap it up.
25 That's all. It's just planning
8
1 testimony. It's also my case under Section
2 10 of the Land Use Law. I think I am
3 allowed to present the case as I deem
4 appropriate as long as it's within the
5 confines of the board rules and
6 regulations.
7 MR. SEGRETO: This will be a
8 departure from the protocol, which this
9 board established at the first meeting, is
10 that each witness will be discretely
11 segregated, the first witness will testify
12 on direct, the board questions, the
13 attorney questions, public questions, my
14 cross-examination, and then the next --
15 MR. DUNN: Actually, Mr.
16 Segreto, this is the procedure that was
17 followed at the first meeting with respect
18 to these two witnesses.
19 MR. KIENZ: That's correct.
20 MR. DUNN: They testified as to
21 two separate aspects of the aspects of the
22 presentation, so I am going to allow that
23 procedure to go forward.
24 MR. GOULD: Okay.
25 MR. KIENZ: All set, Laura?
9
1 Michael, are you all set?
2 MR. GIARDINO: Yes, sir.
3 MR. KIENZ: I think -- if it's
4 all right, I think the board has got to
5 come onto this side.
6 I also, in order to have a good
7 transcribable record, it seems to me it
8 would be helpful to probably put them over
9 here, since the middle is kind of taken up
10 by some projection and by Mr. Segreto, so I
11 want our stenographer to be able to see
12 them.
13 MR. GOULD: All right. I think
14 we should move down so we can see it.
15 MR. KIENZ: Now, as you are doing
16 that, I also want to indicate -- I will
17 wait.
18 Are we all set? If I talk loud
19 enough -- all set.
20 Okay. Laura and Michael, before we
21 get started, I want to remind you that you
22 are both under oath and you are under oath
23 and you were qualified at the first hearing
24 on this matter, which means you have to
25 tell the truth and you swore that you
Staines
10
1 would.
2 Understood?
3 MS. STAINES: Yes.
4 MR. GIARDINO: Yes, sir.
5 MR. SEGRETO: May I have the name
6 of the witness.
7 MR. DUNN: I didn't hear Mr.
8 Segreto.
9 MR. KIENZ: He asked if we could
10 have the name of the witness.
11 MR. KIENZ: I said we will get to
12 that in a minute.
13 MR. DUNN: Okay.
14 MR. KIENZ: The other thing I
15 want to indicate before we begin, this
16 starts the heart of the planning testimony,
17 which is really in response to the
18 ordinance requirements, and we have plans
19 that are submitted on file.
20 One of the -- Steve, what plate is
21 on the board right now?
22 MR. WEIR: That's Plate 146.
23 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Would you go
24 to the next plate, please.
25 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
Staines
11
1 MR. SEGRETO: Can you give me the
2 name of the witness so I can write it down?
3 MR. KIENZ: I am going to. They
4 haven't said anything yet. Let me do my
5 case.
6 What I would like to indicate to the
7 board is that as a result of meetings that
8 were held with the review committee and as
9 a result of our looking at the plans and as
10 a result of listening to some public
11 comments that were made, the ferry
12 maintenance building, which I am showing
13 with the laser, which is on the south side
14 of the property -- this is plate what,
15 Steve --
16 MR. WEIR: 195.
17 MR. KIENZ: -- is going to be
18 removed from the application, so we are no
19 longer seeking approval for the ferry
20 maintenance building. It's no longer part
21 of the plans.
22 I want to state that on the record.
23 MR. SEGRETO: Have you prepared a
24 modified amended plan?
25 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Chairman, I want
Staines
12
1 to put my case in, and all I am asking is
2 for an opportunity to do that.
3 We will be happy to respond to
4 questions from the board, but if we could,
5 I would like to just be able to put my
6 testimony in.
7 MR. DUNN: Let's put the case
8 in.
9 MR. SEGRETO: Mr. Chairman, most
10 respectfully, if he is telling us verbally
11 that he is eliminating something, that
12 means he must generate an amended plan
13 showing the elimination and what's going to
14 be there, if it's going to be open space,
15 if it's going to be something else.
16 I am not asking idle questions.
17 MR. GOULD: You will have time in
18 your cross-examination to ask whatever
19 questions you want.
20 If you would please refrain during
21 his presentation, you will be able to do
22 that and then we will get on with it.
23 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Chairman, I will
24 still respond to that, but I would like to
25 have the chance to put on my case
Staines
13
1 unmolested.
2 The answer is we are proposing
3 nothing, no other use for that section of
4 the property.
5 Now, Laura, would you please state
6 your name for the record and spell your
7 last name once more.
8 MS. STAINES: Laura Kathryn
9 Staines, S-t-a-i-n-e-s.
10 MR. KIENZ: Michael, would you
11 please do likewise.
12 MR. GIARDINO: Michael David
13 Giardino, G-i-a-r-d-i-n-o.
14 MR. KIENZ: Thank you.
15 Okay. Laura, would you please
16 describe the general character and
17 substance of the planned development before
18 the board.
19 MS. STAINES: Yes. I would like to
20 take a few moments to point out some
21 characteristics.
22 MR. KIENZ: Laura, please make
23 sure you are talking into the microphone.
24 I know -- I am having trouble hearing over
25 here. I know other people are, too.
Staines
14
1 MS. STAINES: Is that clear?
2 A few key aspects of the plan, I
3 will start with a few statistics, and I
4 will go into the actual development of the
5 program.
6 The overall site, both land and
7 water area, comprises 204.37 acres.
8 The water area of the application
9 totals 111.978 acres, and the actual
10 project land area is 92.4 acres.
11 The site is located at the easterly
12 edge of the Township of Weehawken. It is
13 part of a planned development district, the
14 northern portion of the planned development
15 district, the southern portion having been
16 developed in prior applications.
17 The westerly edge of this particular
18 planned development shown is coincidental
19 with the right-of-way of JFK Boulevard. It
20 includes major roadway access, including
21 Pershing Road and, of course, the existing
22 Port Imperial Boulevard, which we will
23 speak of later, which will be realigned
24 during the planning process.
25 The overall community is planned as
Staines
15
1 an extension of Weehawken in that it
2 integrates a mix-use concept.
3 We contemplated a community that is
4 comprised of office, hotel, residential,
5 retail, transportation opportunities,
6 recreational facilities and banquet
7 facilities, as well as provisions of
8 significant open space and public access
9 for not only the residents of the
10 community, the residents of the Township of
11 Weehawken and the public at large.
12 The overall plan moving from north
13 to south consists of a complex of
14 commercial buildings.
15 This particular portion of the site
16 --
17 MR. KIENZ: "This portion," what
18 are you referring to, Laura?
19 MS. STAINES: The northern section
20 of the site where it borders West New York,
21 will contain a combination of office uses
22 and retail uses, which will front onto the
23 primary streets.
24 The building to the north and east
25 is composed of a combination of hotel and
Staines
16
1 conference facility.
2 In relationship to this utilization
3 of the office and retail space, as well as
4 taking advantage of the light rail station,
5 we will propose the relocation of the ferry
6 terminal.
7 To the south of the office complex
8 is a series of residential buildings of
9 varying heights, which are bordered to the
10 westerly edge by Port Imperial Boulevard
11 and to the easterly edge by the Hudson
12 River itself.
13 A roadway network circulates
14 thoughout the site, and we also made
15 provisions for the extension of a
16 waterfront walkway throughout the entire
17 site from the West New York boundary all
18 the way to the southern end of the
19 property, where it will then engage with
20 the property owners to the south.
21 The waterfront walkway is not only
22 mandated by DEP, but it's also required by
23 the town of Weehawken.
24 We made provisions for the provision
25 of the 30-foot right-of-way throughout the
Staines
17
1 entire length of Port Imperial South with
2 the one exception of the area immediately
3 to the east of the existing banana
4 building.
5 MR. KIENZ: Laura, what are the
6 objectives and purposes to be served by
7 this planned development?
8 MS. STAINES: There are quite a
9 number.
10 First, of course, we contemplate
11 remediation of an existing brownfield site,
12 cleanup and reuse of existing facilities,
13 including existing structures on-site.
14 We are creating and preserving
15 significant amounts of metropolitan open
16 space for the public enjoyment.
17 We are extending the waterfront
18 walkway from West New York to the southern
19 end of our property.
20 We are managing traffic through the
21 integration of a variety of transportation
22 alternatives and creating an intermodal
23 access point for residents and commuters.
24 We are providing a mix-use
25 community, which will integrate residential
Staines
18
1 office, retail, restaurant, hotel and the
2 other uses that we have previously spoken
3 of. The purpose of this is to create a
4 viable community and to enhance the tax
5 base of the Township of Weehawken.
6 We are also providing sufficient
7 residential uses on the site in order to
8 create a viable 24-hour community, which is
9 not only an advantage to maintaining the
10 integrity of the community, but would
11 promote a safe environment for visitors and
12 the public.
13 We are also very keen on providing
14 an aesthetically-pleasing and certainly
15 well-known, world-class community.
16 And last but certainly not least and
17 very, very important, in our overall
18 planning, is to maintain the significant
19 views of the Palisades and to follow the
20 requirements of the ordinance in order to
21 preserve and/or enhance those views.
22 MR. KIENZ: Laura, did you have a
23 chance to review the master plan for this
24 municipality?
25 MS. STAINES: Yes, I did.
Staines
19
1 MR. KIENZ: Are the plans that we
2 have prepared consistent with that?
3 MS. STAINES: Yes, they are.
4 MR. KIENZ: How are they
5 consistent?
6 MS. STAINES: There are a number of
7 objectives that were outlined in the master
8 plan.
9 MR. KIENZ: Steve, would you --
10 MS. STAINES: Perhaps, if we could
11 see the zoning plan, I think that's Plate
12 255
13 MR. WEIR: Plate 255.
14 MS. STAINES: Oh -- I beg your
15 pardon -- right. I overlooked this
16 paragraph.
17 This particular paragraph, I think,
18 sums up the recommendations that we
19 followed.
20 The planning board recommends a
21 means of inducing substantial private
22 investment in waterfront redevelopment,
23 that a reasonable basic level of
24 development be permitted on the waterfront.
25 This basic level could be
Staines
20
1 constructed only if a developer can show
2 sufficient access and other infrastructure
3 for its project positive cash flow to the
4 township and market feasibility.
5 MR. KIENZ: Where did you get
6 that statement from, Laura?
7 MS. STAINES: That's directly out
8 of the master plan.
9 In addition to that, there were
10 several stated items in the master plan as
11 far as stabilizing and revitalizing
12 existing communities, upgrading and
13 expanding housing to attract new residents,
14 remediate the brownfield site, improve the
15 physical health of the township, manage
16 traffic and again to create metropolitan
17 open space.
18 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Does the plan
19 as we are proposing it, conform to the
20 municipal master plan?
21 MS. STAINES: Yes, it does.
22 MR. KIENZ: Would you go to the
23 next plate, please, Steve.
24 MR. WEIR: Plate 222.
25 MR. KIENZ: Would you please
Staines
21
1 describe what's shown up on the screen,
2 Laura.
3 MS. STAINES: Yes.
4 This represents the zoning map of
5 the Township of Weehawken in its entirety,
6 and if we can direct our attention to the
7 water that we are discussing this evening
8 of --
9 MR. KIENZ: You are tracing what
10 area? You are tracing the northern --
11 MS. STAINES: What I am attempting
12 to trace, I may have missed it in my first
13 pass, is actually the confines of the
14 property that we are describing this
15 evening as part of the application for Port
16 Imperial South, which, if you can see, it's
17 -- if not, I will be happy to describe, is
18 only a portion, but the northern most
19 portion of the planned development
20 district.
21 The southern portion, which is this
22 outline that I am following now, is the
23 property that was owned by Hartz Mountain
24 and has recently been developed as a
25 combination office, retail, residential,
Staines
22
1 hotel complex in a very similar
2 characteristic to that proposed for Port
3 Imperial South.
4 MR. KIENZ: Okay. And is it your
5 testimony then that the planned development
6 that is currently pending before the board
7 is -- as part of this application is
8 consistent with what's going on in the
9 south?
10 MS. STAINES: Yes, it is.
11 MR. KIENZ: Is it also consistent
12 with what's taking place on the top of the
13 cliffs in Weehawken? Did we do things to
14 try to connect it in?
15 MS. STAINES: Absolutely. A number
16 of characteristics, which are evidenced in
17 the site plan, which we will be happy to
18 describe when we get to the point of the
19 site plan review, again, is the integration
20 of the street grids, so that they are
21 reflective of those that are appropriate
22 for upper Weehawken, the integration of the
23 mixed use, which is consistent with a
24 number of the primary streets throughout
25 the Weehawken community.
Staines
23
1 The major difference, of course, is
2 the fact that this particular waterfront
3 development does have that benefit, the
4 waterfront edge itself, so some special
5 treatments have been applied in that case.
6 MR. KIENZ: Laura, I would like
7 to take and turn your attention to
8 standards for planned development which is
9 Section 22-10.2 of the Weehawken ordinance.
10 For everyone's benefit it's on Page
11 2267 of the most recent copy of the
12 ordinance.
13 MS. STAINES: Okay. I have it.
14 MR. KIENZ: One of the standards
15 is that we have certain criterian to meet
16 as regards streets.
17 Would you please go and describe the
18 streets that we have on this plan.
19 MS. STAINES: Yes.
20 Steve, could we get back to the site
21 plan, please.
22 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
23 MS. STAINES: Thank you.
24 There are a few significant street
25 variations within the overall site plan.
Staines
24
1 MR. KIENZ: Let's start from the
2 north and work our way south. Okay?
3 MS. STAINES: Certainly.
4 The primary road all of us are
5 familiar with is the existing Port Imperial
6 Boulevard. This site plan, the
7 application, that is, allows for a
8 realignment for Port Imperial Boulevard
9 within the confines of this particular
10 planned development application.
11 It will begin at its connection with
12 West New York and be realigned so that it
13 will provide intersections that will now
14 integrate with the internal north/south
15 roadway that proceeds southbound from West
16 New York.
17 Port Imperial Boulevard is contained
18 from a 68-foot right-of-way from the
19 property line of West New York, following
20 through the community and extending as far
21 as Pershing Road.
22 That road will be four lanes, two
23 lanes in either direction.
24 To the south of Pershing Road, Port
25 Imperial Boulevard will now be reduced to a
Staines
25
1 two-lane, one-way lane in each direction,
2 with a lane for turning.
3 The balance of the roads within the
4 community are divided into two or three
5 smaller groups. The primary road
6 throughout the community, which I am
7 outlining here, are primary north/south
8 roads, are two lanes, one lane in either
9 direction for two-way traffic, plus there
10 is parallel parking on both sides of the
11 street.
12 The dimensions of the road are 24
13 feet in width for the travel lanes and
14 eight feet on either side for the parking
15 lanes.
16 In addition, we propose single-lane
17 roads, one-way traffic, beginning at the
18 southerly extension of the cove and
19 proceeding southbound and coincidental with
20 the waterfront walkway so as to provide
21 direct public access not only for the
22 pedestrians but also for the vehicular
23 traffic.
24 The purpose of the one-way road is
25 to provide unobstructed views from a
Staines
26
1 southerly direction, which are quite
2 superior, and also to protect the safety of
3 the automobile driver to avoid any
4 conflicts with oncoming traffic.
5 There are one or two additional
6 two-way roads, for example, the service
7 road in front of the brownstones, which
8 provides access to each of those individual
9 residents without requiring them to exit
10 onto Port Imperial Boulevard in order to
11 access the balance of the community.
12 MR. KIENZ: Are these roads
13 designed to accommodate fire fighting and
14 other emergency equipment?
15 MS. STAINES: Yes, they are.
16 MR. KIENZ: Are these roads, to
17 the best of your knowledge, designed to
18 conform to the residential site improvement
19 standards as is appropriate for given
20 sections of this development?
21 MS. STAINES: Yes, it is.
22 MR. KIENZ: Will these roads also
23 be designed in accordance with ASHTO
24 standards?
25 MS. STAINES: You would have to
Staines
27
1 defer to the traffic engineer for
2 confirmation of that.
3 MR. KIENZ: In fact, from a
4 planning perspective, it's your opinion
5 that the streets, as laid out on this set
6 of plans, is an appropriate street design
7 from a planning perspective. Is that
8 correct?
9 MR. SEGRETO: I have a continuing
10 objection to the obvious leading and
11 improper nature of the questions.
12 This is direct examination. What
13 counsel is doing is not permissible, and
14 the cases have held that this proceeding is
15 a quasi-judicial proceeding and what he is
16 doing is not permissible.
17 I will object -- I won't each time
18 he does it -- to put the objection on the
19 record.
20 MR. DUNN: We will note your
21 continuing objection, Mr. Segreto.
22 The witness may answer.
23 MR. SEGRETO: Would somebody rule
24 on my objection?
25 MR. DUNN: I just ruled. I said
Staines
28
1 we will note your continuing objection, and
2 the objection is overruled.
3 MR. SEGRETO: You don't think they
4 are leading questions?
5 MR. DUNN: The objection is
6 overruled.
7 MR. KIENZ: Is there anything
8 else you wanted to tell the board regarding
9 the streets, Laura?
10 MS. STAINES: I believe there -- we
11 had contemplated the provision of separate
12 service roads thoughout the community, but
13 it was our professional opinion that the
14 roadways that are designed within the
15 community are sufficient to provide access
16 not only to the vehicular travel for
17 automobiles but also for all service and
18 utility vehicles as well, so they will be
19 using the primary road systems.
20 MR. KIENZ: I would like to turn
21 your attention now to "Common Open Space,"
22 which is Section 22-10.2B.
23 That's also on Page 2268.
24 MS. STAINES: Yes.
25 MR. KIENZ: Are you all set?
Staines
29
1 MS. STAINES: Yes.
2 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Are you
3 familiar with the priority list of common
4 open space under the ordinance?
5 MS. STAINES: Yes.
6 The ordinance has a defined
7 provision of common open space in that
8 provision.
9 MR. KIENZ: Does the applicant
10 own any land in areas on top of the
11 Palisades which will be preserved and
12 beautified?
13 MS. STAINES: The applicant owns no
14 such lands.
15 MR. KIENZ: The second priority
16 on that list is "The cliff face of the
17 Palisades, which is to be preserved."
18 Would you please tell the board how
19 we are preserving the cliff faces of the
20 Palisades.
21 MS. STAINES: Yes.
22 The westerly boundary moving from
23 the southern extension of our site
24 paralleling Port Imperial Boulevard and
25 then continuing up to 48th Street, the
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1 extension; that is, of 48th Street, is all
2 considered a sensitive area and will be
3 preserved without development as part of
4 the Palisades cliff face.
5 In addition, the area to the north
6 of the extension of 48th Street and also to
7 the west of the realigned Port Imperial
8 Boulevard will also be preserved without
9 any construction planned.
10 MR. KIENZ: Has the applicant
11 proposed a waterfront park consisting of at
12 least five continuous acres?
13 MS. STAINES: Yes.
14 The applicant has proposed a park
15 actually containing 6.08 acres, and it's
16 located to the south of the banana
17 building. It also contains public parking
18 and direct access to the waterfront
19 walkway.
20 MR. KIENZ: Does the applicant's
21 plan propose a plaza and pedestrian areas
22 interspersed throughout the development?
23 MS. STAINES: Yes.
24 There is a significant amount of
25 plazas, public parks and other open space
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1 elements, which will be addressed in
2 further testimony.
3 MR. KIENZ: Just for the record
4 now, could you tell us where they are and
5 describe there locations, size and views?
6 MS. STAINES: Certainly.
7 It was our plan in developing the
8 overall community that there would be
9 consolidated open space in certain key
10 areas, but we also recognize the fact that
11 open space is a very important amenity.
12 Interspersing small areas throughout the
13 site for the benefit of all the residents,
14 starting at the southerly edge that I
15 already pointed out, happy to repeat, there
16 is a park of 6.8 acres. This park will be
17 dedicated to the township.
18 As we proceed to the north, I have
19 already commented on the Palisades, which
20 are not part of the overall plaza area, but
21 you can see it's a very significant part of
22 the open space, which will be to the
23 benefit of the residents and the township
24 residents as well.
25 Within the community, however, there
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1 are several distinct areas, for example,
2 the central portion, the central plaza of
3 the brownstone area will be highlighted as
4 an amenity.
5 Immediately to the north of Arthur's
6 Landing and at the foot of Pershing Road
7 there is also proposed a three-quarter acre
8 public park, which will be integrated with
9 the waterfront walkway.
10 There is also a round-about circle
11 in the center, which will focus its
12 attention on the retail activities within
13 the central portion of the site. We
14 anticipate this will be a highly amentized
15 landscaped area, which will actually be
16 quite a gathering point for residents and
17 visitors.
18 As we proceed further north, we also
19 have significant areas surrounding the
20 hotel so that any activities associated
21 with the hotel are available to the public
22 will have ample room for outdoor
23 activities.
24 There is another extremely
25 significant part of the open space, and
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1 that is there are additional esplanades and
2 open space that are part of or an extension
3 of the waterfront walkway. They are
4 parallel to the waterfront walkway and
5 extend throughout the entire residential
6 portion of the community until they reach
7 Arthur's Landing.
8 MR. KIENZ: Now, will there be
9 continuous access through various points to
10 this waterfront and to these park areas?
11 MS. STAINES: There is significant
12 continuous access throughout the community.
13 MR. KIENZ: Would you briefly
14 show where they are on the plans, too,
15 continuous access.
16 MS. STAINES: Thank you.
17 Starting again at the north, at the
18 hotel area, are internal roadways, in fact,
19 it is adjacent to the waterfront walkway.
20 This will provide unlimited access for the
21 pedestrians and/or riders in vehicles to
22 gain access to the waterfront walkway.
23 That roadway continues around the
24 cove and then proceeds through the
25 residential community as a single-lane
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1 automobile or vehicular roadway system,
2 which will continue to provide unlimited
3 access for the public to the waterfront
4 walkway.
5 There are also perpendicular drives
6 throughout so that access can be gained
7 from a number of points. This drive
8 provides access to the waterfront walkway
9 for the continued length of the residential
10 complex until it reaches the open space
11 park referred to earlier.
12 At that point we are engaged with an
13 existing privately-owned marina dock
14 facility, which is the actual waterfront
15 use. It is proposed that the waterfront
16 walkway now integrate with the public park
17 to be a greater amenity. Although it is
18 not at the edge of the river front, it is
19 proximate to the river front and becomes a
20 significant open space amenity.
21 The waterfront walkway continues to
22 the easterly edge of the brownstone
23 buildings where visitors and pedestrians
24 can utilize the waterfront walkway. At the
25 southern end of the brownstones, there is a
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1 provision for additional public parking and
2 direct perpendicular waterfront walkway
3 access.
4 The walkway continues southbound,
5 proceeds, as I have described earlier, in
6 front of the renovated banana building. To
7 the immediate south of the banana building
8 is additional parking, including public
9 parking, which will be dedicated as part of
10 the public park, and at that point there is
11 unlimited access to the waterfront walkway
12 throughout that public facility.
13 MR. KIENZ: Does the -- you are
14 familiar that the ordinance also requires
15 that common open space is subject to the
16 requirement that the applicant establish a
17 property owners' association for the
18 ownership and maintenance of any common
19 open space?
20 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
21 MR. KIENZ: That's not going to
22 be dedicated to the township. Is that
23 correct?
24 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
25 MR. KIENZ: Would you describe
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1 what's anticipated in responding to this
2 requirement of the ordinance.
3 MS. STAINES: Actually, what is
4 proposed at this juncture, is that the
5 community to the immediate north, which is
6 Port Imperial North, has a property owners'
7 association agreement for the preservation
8 of the open space and the maintenance of
9 the open space.
10 It's the applicant's intention to
11 present to the board a similar document so
12 that the preservation and maintenance of
13 the open space will be done in a continuous
14 manner.
15 MR. KIENZ: The next area
16 concerns the phasing of development.
17 Do we propose to develop this parcel
18 over a period of years?
19 MS. STAINES: Yes, we do.
20 MR. KIENZ: How many years?
21 MS. STAINES: We have a ten-year
22 expectation for construction of the
23 community.
24 MR. KIENZ: Would you please
25 describe the phases.
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1 MS. STAINES: Certainly.
2 Phase 1, which is anticipated to
3 take between two and four years, includes
4 several items.
5 The first is the renovation of the
6 banana building, which will enlarge
7 existing office space, introduce a banquet
8 facility and health club facility.
9 In addition, we have relocated the
10 existing Jamestown ferry terminal. A new
11 ferry terminal will be located in the cove,
12 as I have described earlier, in order to be
13 proximate to the high-intensity retail use.
14 The brownstone buildings to the
15 south of Pershing Road, which will contain
16 48 luxury dwelling units, will also be part
17 of the Phase 1 community.
18 In addition, Building 15, as we
19 refer to it, which is also known as a
20 senior housing building, is located
21 immediately to the north of Pershing Road,
22 and that's also contemplated as part of
23 Phase 1, and, most importantly, the
24 provision of the open-space dedicated park
25 for the benefit of the public.
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1 Oh, Phase 2 -- Phase 2 will focus
2 the primary attention on the areas
3 surrounding the ferry terminal.
4 The construction will include the
5 hotel and conference facility.
6 To the west of the ferry terminal we
7 are contemplating twin office towers
8 sitting at the top the structured parking.
9 The structured parking will be
10 accommodating patrons of the ferry
11 terminal, as well as the office users.
12 Immediately to the south of the
13 ferry terminal is an exclusive office
14 building. Immediately to the south of the
15 office building is a combination of a mixed
16 use building, which will contain
17 residential and retail use and the
18 predominant needs -- parking needs for both
19 residential and the adjoining office use.
20 Further to the south and along the
21 waterfront, the residential building
22 featuring retail on its westerly edge will
23 also be contained in Phase II.
24 That timetable will take
25 approximately -- will begin approximately
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1 four years from now and terminate
2 approximately seven years from now, roughly
3 a three-year window.
4 The final stages, the balance of the
5 buildings will include the building to the
6 northerly -- north and west of the site,
7 which is a combination of office, retail
8 and parking facility.
9 The balance of the residential,
10 which you see three buildings proposed
11 along the waterfront, there are two
12 additional buildings to the west of the
13 rotary and one further, residential
14 building, to the south of Pershing Road.
15 That proposed time frame would be
16 approximately seven to ten years from now.
17 MR. KIENZ: Okay. And you are
18 aware this is a preliminary phasing
19 schedule, and at the time we seek any final
20 planned development approval pursuant to
21 the ordinance, we have to come in and make
22 sure -- and obtain planning board approval.
23 Is that correct?
24 MS. STAINES: Absolutely.
25 MR. KIENZ: Do you have anything
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1 else -- I am sorry -- each phase that you
2 are talking about, will it be substantially
3 functional and self-contained and
4 self-sustained?
5 MS. STAINES: Yes.
6 MR. KIENZ: Now, will it be so
7 with regard to access?
8 MS. STAINES: Yes.
9 MR. KIENZ: Let's go through
10 Phase 1 and just describe it as a
11 representative of how the rest of it will
12 work.
13 MS. STAINES: Very simply, Phase 1,
14 if I could just reiterate, the buildings we
15 discussed earlier will contain a relocated
16 ferry terminal.
17 To the south is the senior housing
18 building, which is at the juncture of Port
19 Imperial Boulevard and Pershing Road. To
20 the south again are the brownstone
21 buildings further to the south, by the
22 banana building. Each of these buildings
23 has direct access either from Port Imperial
24 Boulevard or in close proximity to Port
25 Imperial Boulevard and directly from the
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1 extension of the exists north/south
2 railroad that extended from West New York.
3 In addition, there will be testimony
4 from the civil engineer regarding the
5 provision of utilities and the opportunity
6 to provide services to all those individual
7 buildings.
8 MR. KIENZ: Okay. How about as
9 regards the parking?
10 MS. STAINES: There is a provision
11 for parking at the banana building.
12 On-grade parking is proposed both to the
13 north and to the south of the building to
14 accommodate prospective uses.
15 Brownstone buildings all contain
16 garages, as well as a provision for
17 on-street guest parking.
18 The senior housing building contains
19 structured parking within the structure of
20 the lower level, and the relocated banana
21 building will be utilizing a portion of the
22 existing on-grade parking during the early
23 phases.
24 The parking that was relocated due
25 to construction of some of the other phased
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1 buildings will be relocated further north
2 and utilize the space that in future phases
3 will be constructed as buildings -- as the
4 office and structured parking buildings, so
5 as time goes on structured parking will
6 replace the on-grade parking, but there is
7 ample space to accommodate the parking that
8 is required at this juncture.
9 MR. KIENZ: How about utilities,
10 Laura?
11 MS. STAINES: As I pointed out
12 earlier, the civil engineer will speak
13 specifically to the provision of utilities,
14 but the primary utilities, the major trunk
15 lines had been installed in the first phase
16 and then the interim, laterals and other
17 extensions will be provided as each
18 individual phaze is constructed.
19 MR. KIENZ: How about open space?
20 MS. STAINES: Open space, the
21 actual dedication of the waterfront park
22 will be provided in Phase 1. The open
23 space related to the Palisades will also be
24 part of the Phase 1 application.
25 At the point that Phases 2 and 3
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1 will be undergoing approval, site plan
2 approval and construction, the balance of
3 the open space will be introduced so that
4 it -- all phases will be in excess of the
5 ordinance requirements.
6 MR. KIENZ: The last requirement
7 of this -- of the ordinance states that you
8 also have to show through testimony, that a
9 given phase will be capable of substantial
10 occupancy, operation and maintenance upon
11 completion of construction and development.
12 Can you tell the board what that
13 means to you and then respond as to whether
14 we are capable of doing that?
15 MS. STAINES: Yes.
16 MR. SEGRETO: I object -- forgive
17 me for a moment -- I am going to object to
18 the form of the question.
19 The marketing --
20 MR. DUNN: I am sorry.
21 MR. SEGRETO: I object to the
22 question, because it includes a predicate
23 of the occupancy, which is a marketing
24 issue, not a planning issue, and this
25 witness has been qualified as a planner,
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1 not as a marketing expert.
2 MR. KIENZ: Okay. We will note
3 your objection, and I would overrule the
4 objection and let the witness testify for
5 what it's worth.
6 MS. STAINES: I am sorry, Glenn,
7 would you mind repeating it again.
8 MR. KIENZ: I am just reading
9 right out of the ordinance.
10 MS. STAINES: If you direct me to
11 the page.
12 MR. KIENZ: Sure.
13 This is on Page 2272.
14 It's Section 22-10.10 -- 10.2D,
15 4(a).
16 MS. STAINES: Okay. I have
17 described four very distinct uses on the
18 site, the ferry terminal, the residential
19 senior housing community, the brownstone
20 community and the renovated banana
21 building, which contains three distinct
22 functions inside.
23 Each of those elements will be
24 constructed, perhaps, by a different
25 entity. Regardless of that fact they will
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1 be marketed separately, and they are
2 completely self-sustaining and in similar
3 fashion to the communities that are
4 proposed that are under construction in
5 West New York.
6 The marketing and maintenance of the
7 individual buildings or clusters of
8 buildings will be maintained by their
9 individual entity.
10 MR. KIENZ: Let me try asking you
11 a different question so everybody is clear
12 on what I think the ordinance is saying.
13 Let's stay with the banana building,
14 which is your example. Is it capable of
15 being used as part of this phase of the
16 development, substantial occupancy?
17 MS. STAINES: Yes, it is.
18 MR. KIENZ: Is it capable of
19 being operated as part of this phase? Will
20 people be able to get their -- will people
21 be able to come and exercise or work in the
22 office or attend a banquet?
23 MS. STAINES: Absolutely.
24 MR. KIENZ: Will it be capable of
25 being maintained, if you need to fix a
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1 window, do something with landscaping,
2 repair a road, something else needs to be
3 done in the form of maintenance, will that
4 be able to be done as part of this phase,
5 can they get to the property?
6 MS. STAINES: Yes, they can.
7 MR. KIENZ: Thank you.
8 Laura, I would like to turn your
9 attention next to the zoning section of the
10 ordinance and specifically the uses that
11 are permitted so we can talk about them.
12 This is on page -- I am sorry -- for
13 the record it's Section 23-10.4, and where
14 we are going is to C, which is "Uses" on
15 Page 2373.
16 Laura, are you familiar with the
17 zoning ordinance, this section in
18 particular?
19 MS. STAINES: Yes, I am.
20 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Would you
21 please describe the uses proposed by the
22 applicant and advise the board if each of
23 the proposed uses is a permitted use.
24 MS. STAINES: Yes, I will.
25 I don't know that I have to identify
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1 -- would you refer that I do each
2 individual building?
3 MR. KIENZ: Yes, please.
4 MS. STAINES: Okay. Starting from
5 the north we have -- we have an office
6 building. Immediately to its east is a
7 hotel conference center. To the southwest
8 are two twin office towers.
9 MR. KIENZ: Laura, let's stay
10 with all the commercial uses now for
11 clarity of the record. Okay?
12 MS. STAINES: Yes.
13 MR. KIENZ: Thank you.
14 MS. STAINES: Immediately to the
15 south of the cove will be another
16 freestanding office structure. The roadway
17 faces the westerly -- I am sorry -- the
18 easterly edge of the westerly buildings and
19 the westerly edge of the easterly buildings
20 will contain elements of retail. The
21 freestanding building will actually have
22 retail that faces it facing the Hudson
23 River.
24 This accomplishes the mix-use
25 characteristics of the commercial element.
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1 MR. KIENZ: What other commercial
2 buildings, Laura?
3 MS. STAINES: Proceeding to the
4 south of the site we have the renovated
5 banana building. There is an existing
6 office in the building, which will be
7 expanded. We have introduced a banquet
8 restaurant facility, as well as an indoor
9 recreational health club facility.
10 In addition, there is an existing
11 restaurant on-site named Arthur's Landing,
12 and, I believe, that covers all except the
13 residential uses.
14 MR. KIENZ: All of the what uses?
15 MS. STAINES: All except the
16 residential uses.
17 MR. KIENZ: Okay. So you covered
18 all of the retail uses?
19 MS. STAINES: Yes.
20 MR. KIENZ: Where are all the
21 retail uses at street level? Can you show
22 them again so we are all clear?
23 MS. STAINES: The extension
24 north/south road from West New York will
25 contain retail on the easterly edge of
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1 these two buildings, plus the independent
2 office building, which faces the river, and
3 then as we proceed southbound, internally
4 into the site, both sides of the
5 residential streets will contain a
6 combination of retail and/or office space.
7 MR. KIENZ: Okay -- I am sorry --
8 go ahead.
9 MS. STAINES: I was just going to
10 add that the additional permitted primary,
11 permitted principal use that is, is the
12 residential component of the site.
13 MR. KIENZ: Okay. Now let's talk
14 about residential and start from the north
15 again and go right down south.
16 MS. STAINES: Well, the
17 introduction of the residential actually
18 occurs to the immediate south of what we
19 refer to as Building 7, which is an
20 independent office structure.
21 Buildings 8 and 9 contains a
22 combination of retail at street level,
23 stacked town houses, multilevel town home
24 units.
25 The interior portion of the
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1 buildings contain structured parking, and
2 that is actually consistent with all but
3 one of the buildings throughout the
4 community. The parking itself is virtually
5 residential and retail office space.
6 Buildings 8 and 9 also contains a
7 significant number of residential units as
8 opposed to the retail parking component.
9 Moving southbound, the twin
10 buildings on either side of the western
11 side, which we refer to as Buildings 11 and
12 13, are also a combination of mixed-use
13 buildings. They have retail on the street
14 facade, office space above for a total of
15 four stories of mix-use.
16 The balance of the floors will
17 contain residential uses, and internal in
18 the building will be the parking that
19 services the needs of those individuals.
20 Immediately to the south is the
21 senior housing component that has been
22 described earlier. There are two stories
23 of parking technically proposed to service
24 the needs of a multi-story building that
25 will dispute the needs of the senior
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1 population.
2 The four buildings to the east of
3 our north/south road will contain retail on
4 the street phase. The balance of buildings
5 had been all residential plus their
6 service-related parking. The building to
7 the south of Pershing Road is consistent
8 with the northerly residential buildings
9 with one exception. It's residential
10 above. It will contain structured parking.
11 A portion of that structured parking
12 will service the needs of the existing
13 marina and also Arthur's Landing
14 Restaurant, as well as the needs of the
15 residents of that particular building.
16 MR. KIENZ: Laura, just one
17 second.
18 MS. STAINES: The remaining
19 component of the residential use is the
20 brownstones, which were the subject of a
21 prior application, and those will be luxury
22 low-rise residential units with integrated
23 garages, private garages, that is, that are
24 waterfront oriented.
25 MR. KIENZ: Now, one of the
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1 requirements of the ordinance is that
2 residential uses have to respond to certain
3 requirements that are contained in
4 Subsection 23-10.4, Paragraph 11 of the
5 ordinance, which, I believe, is on Page
6 2394 of the most recent edition.
7 Is that correct?
8 MS. STAINES: That's correct.
9 MR. KIENZ: Do we comply with
10 that section of the ordinance?
11 MS. STAINES: Yes, we do.
12 MR. KIENZ: That section of the
13 ordinance specifically provides that the
14 area devoted to residents shall have a
15 gross residential density as defined in
16 Subsection 23-3.1 of not more than 100
17 dwelling units per acre.
18 Would you please tell the board what
19 the amount of dwelling units per acre we
20 are proposing is.
21 MS. STAINES: Yes. Certainly.
22 I will begin by telling the board we
23 are proposing 1632 residential units.
24 As I mentioned earlier, the entire
25 developable land area is 92.4 acres. If
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1 you take the 1632 dwelling units and you
2 divide it by the entire developable land
3 area, 92.4, you achieve a gross density of
4 17.66 units per acre, which is well below
5 the 100-per-acre allowable.
6 If you do -- if you go further and
7 recognize that the residential is actually
8 concentrated from a portion of the site, we
9 have further defined a separate, as we
10 refer to it, gross density calculation.
11 The acreage devoted to the
12 combination of residential retail and
13 office use is 23 acres. Again if you
14 divide 1632 dwelling units by the
15 approximately 23 acres, we are in the range
16 of 70 units per acre, also significantly
17 less than 100 units per acre allowed.
18 MR. KIENZ: Laura, under that
19 section of the ordinance, there are also
20 conditions applicable to north of the
21 King's Bluff dividing line.
22 First, where is the King's Bluff
23 dividing line?
24 MS. STAINES: The King's Bluff
25 dividing line is to the south of the
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1 southerly property line of this planned
2 development application.
3 MR. KIENZ: So it's south of our
4 parcel?
5 MS. STAINES: Correct. And it
6 doesn't apply to our parcel.
7 MR. KIENZ: Okay. And Subsection
8 10.4 -- I am sorry -- 23-10.4, Paragraph L,
9 Subparagraph 3(a) provides that the
10 aggregate number of dwelling units in all
11 planned developments shall not exceed
12 4,525.00
13 Do we meet that requirement?
14 MS. STAINES: That applies to
15 conditions north of the King's Bluff
16 dividing line, and we do comply.
17 MR. KIENZ: Subparagraph (b)
18 provides that the aggregate floor area -- I
19 am sorry -- how did you do that
20 calculation?
21 MS. STAINES: Which one?
22 MR. KIENZ: The last question for
23 the aggregate number of dwelling units in
24 all planned developments shall not exceed
25 4525 units.
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1 MS. STAINES: First of all, the
2 preceding sentence points out that these
3 are conditions applicable north of the
4 King's Bluff dividing line. We are the
5 only application, and we are the remaining
6 portion of the planned development district
7 that lies north of the King's Bluff
8 dividing line, and, therefore, the
9 residential unit count on our property is
10 the only residential unit count that
11 applies.
12 MR. KIENZ: Thank you.
13 MS. STAINES: You are welcome.
14 MR. KIENZ: Subparagraph (b)
15 provides the aggregate floor area of the
16 dwelling units in all planned developments
17 excluding common areas within the buildings
18 and excluding garages shall not exceed
19 4,481,750 square feet.
20 Do we comply with that?
21 MS. STAINES: Yes, we do comply.
22 MR. KIENZ: How did you decide
23 that we do? How did you make that
24 determination?
25 MS. STAINES: We have provided a
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