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WEEHAWKEN PLANNING BOARD HEARING
DECEMBER
9, 1999
FULL TRANSCRIPT
PAGES
111 TO 166

Witne
ss Laura Staines and Michael Giardino

Professional Planner & Architect
Direct Testimony

Cross-Examination by the Planning Board

Below is the transcript from the Weehawken Planning Board Hearing on December 9th, 1999.  This html document follows the format of the official transcript. The transcript format has 25 lines per page. Each page is numbered. Because the transcript is so long, the file has been broken down into 4 different web pages.

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111
1 MR. DUNN: No. I am having
2 difficulty seeing the relevancy of that
3 entire line of questioning, Mr. Kienz.
4 Is it your position that this
5 applicant has vested rights in a 28-foot
6 easement because of some prior action by
7 the board of adjustment?
8 MR. KIENZ: My position is that
9 we certainly have to provide testimony on
10 the record, but there is some action,
11 although there are changes of use out there
12 and at the time the banana building comes
13 in, we will be providing additional
14 testimony.
15 All I am asking is the board to take
16 judicial notice of a decision by a sister
17 board.
18 I withdraw that.
19 MR. SEGRETO: You just want to -- I
20 just want to interpose --
21 MR. KIENZ: I just withdrew it.
22 MR. DUNN: He is withdrawing the
23 question. The entire line of questioning
24 from the time it began questioning the
25 witness about the board of adjustment is
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
112
1 stricken.
2 MR. SEGRETO: Well, it can't be
3 stricken from the record. The court
4 reporter understands that. It's going to
5 stay in the record.
6 MR. KIENZ: This is taking my
7 time.
8 MR. SEGRETO: I assume you are
9 stating it's not relevant.
10 I don't want any misunderstanding,
11 the reporter thinks he doesn't put that
12 part into the record.
13 MR. KIENZ: The reporter
14 understands what he is supposed to do.
15 Let's move on.
16 MR. SEGRETO: I have been very,
17 very quiet here tonight.
18 Q Michael --
19 A I don't think I quite completed my
20 answer to your primary question --
21 Q Go ahead.
22 A -- which related to the availability
23 of an easement, and I was noting that, yes, we
24 have a continuous easement along the waterfront
25 from the very northern end of our site through to
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
113
1 the southern end.
2 That easement is the required 30 feet
3 within all areas with the single exception of a
4 special request area for a variance at the
5 existing banana building, and throughout that
6 easement, in its entirety, the width of the
7 improved waterfront walkway will be, as required,
8 16-feet nine inches.
9 Q Will the easement or a portion of it
10 be paved?
11 A Yes, the 16-nine-inch portion would
12 be similar to what we had shown on the previous
13 slide.
14 Steve, if you could put that up again.
15 MR. WEIR: It will take me a
16 second to retrieve that.
17 Plate 206. 206.
18 THE WITNESS: Just to refresh the
19 board's memory, this is the kind of
20 construction we are talking about.
21 Ornamental pavers, rather special
22 luminares, an open rail to give you a good
23 feel for the water and view out to the
24 river itself, park benches and a heavily
25 landscaped portion on the in-board side of
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
114
1 the walkway.
2 Q Will this easement be granted in
3 perpetuity?
4 A Yes, it will.
5 MR. SEGRETO: Most respectfully,
6 this witness is not competent to testify as
7 to whether or not an easement is in
8 perpetuity.
9 If he wants to demonstrate that the
10 easement is in perpetuity, he should bring
11 it in and have it marked as an exhibit.
12 If somebody is going to testify to
13 it, I cross-examine him as to whether or
14 not it is, in fact, in perpetuity.
15 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Chairman, there
16 are certain proofs that I am not being
17 allowed to make without interruption.
18 One of the requirements is that such
19 an easement shall be granted in perpetuity
20 without charge upon such terms as the
21 planning board or other governing authority
22 having jurisdiction shall deem appropriate
23 to assure the continued maintenance
24 thereof.
25 All we were responding to is the
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
115
1 ordinance requirement.
2 MR. SEGRETO: You got the wrong
3 person to tell us if it's in perpetuity.
4 MR. KIENZ: Mr. Chairman, I am
5 going to object.
6 I resent --
7 MR. SEGRETO: You haven't
8 established that he read the easement.
9 MR. KIENZ: I resent someone
10 telling me how to present my case.
11 MR. DUNN: The objection is
12 sustained.
13 MR. SEGRETO: Did you say
14 "sustained"?
15 MR. DUNN: Sustained.
16 MR. SEGRETO: Thank you.
17 Q Michael, let's turn next to common
18 open space.
19 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
20 A Where are we now referencing the
21 code? There are several places where common open
22 space is discussed.
23 Q I believe on Page 2378 -- I am sorry
24 -- let's not do it that way.
25 Let's turn to "Height." Turn to "Height"
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
116
1 on Page 2382, Subsection (g).
2 A Yes, sir.
3 Q Subjection (g) requires the
4 "regulations shall control the height of all
5 buildings, structures and signs."
6 "North of the King's Bluff dividing line,"
7 the first requirement is that "No building,
8 rooftop structure, other structure or sign located
9 north of the King's Bluff dividing line but south
10 of the southerly boundary of the North Weehawken
11 view plane shall have a height greater than 50
12 feet above sea level."
13 Would you please explain that section.
14 MR. WEIR: Plate 222.
15 THE WITNESS: This is the zoning
16 plan.
17 I would like to first orient the
18 board to where those two reference lines
19 occur in the town.
20 I am now pointing to the King's
21 Bluff dividing line, which has, you can see
22 here, is just to the south of our property
23 line, which is the start line.
24 If you recall, the southern most
25 boundary of the North Weehawken view plane
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
117
1 is illustrated by this dashed line here, so
2 the zone that you are referring to on our
3 site is in the area that I am circling at
4 the extreme southern portion of our PD.
5 Steve, if you could go to the PD map
6 itself.
7 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
8 THE WITNESS: I would just like to
9 reference you to the region that I was
10 circling in this vicinity here. On this
11 drawing it contains the park and the site
12 that had been the ferry maintenance
13 building.
14 That building, as you heard this
15 evening, has been withdrawn from this
16 application. We are in full compliance
17 with the requirement not to have a building
18 that would exceed 50 feet above sea level.
19 In fact, we have no buildings in
20 that area at all in this application.
21 Q Subsection (b) of that provides, "No
22 building, rooftop structure, other structure or
23 sign located north of the southerly boundary of
24 the Weehawken view plane and south of the easterly
25 prolongation of the centerline of Cooper Place
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 shall penetrate the North Weehawken view plane.
2 Would you please review that section.
3 MR. WEIR: Plate 222.
4 THE WITNESS: Back to the zoning
5 map again to orient the board, you will
6 recall the southern boundary of the
7 northern Weehawken view plane is in this
8 region on our site.
9 The northern boundary is described
10 as the extension of Coopers center --
11 centerline, and that's this side line here
12 to the north.
13 Steve, if you could go back to the
14 PD map.
15 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
16 THE WITNESS: I will orient the
17 board.
18 In terms of our development plan,
19 the southern line -- the northern line
20 flips right across this area as we refer to
21 Buildings 8 and 15.
22 Therefore, this area of our site,
23 the predominant residential portion,
24 including the banana building itself, falls
25 within that U requirement area.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
119
1 We are in full compliance with the
2 regulations for the North Weehawken view
3 plane.
4 If you would like, I can go into
5 some detail how that plane works.
6 Q Why don't you do that quickly.
7 THE WITNESS: Steve, if you could
8 please put up the exhibit that was prepared
9 in the study. I believe it was 1993, the
10 Buckerst, Fish, Hulton, Katz & Jacquemart
11 study.
12 MR. WEIR: Plate 215.
13 MR. SEGRETO: Most respectfully,
14 could you try to keep your voice up.
15 THE WITNESS: I am sorry. I am
16 accused of being overly loud.
17 This is a graphic in the study
18 which, I think, will help explain how the
19 North Weehawken view plane works.
20 From a defined viewpoint elevation
21 at the easterly curb line of Boulevard
22 East, a point five feet above the
23 referenced elevation point, now this is a
24 continuous line of points. One would have
25 to survey every point in order to have a
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
120
1 full data base, but from those reference
2 points, five feet above an imaginary
3 sloping plane is created to the centerline
4 -- I am sorry -- to the centerline of the
5 Hudson River at an elevation of minus 1.6
6 feet.
7 No building or structure is allowed
8 to exceed the height of that sloping line
9 at any point, so, as you can see from this
10 graphic, the further west you are, the
11 higher you are permitted to go; the further
12 east you are, the lower you must be.
13 Q This document you are referring to
14 is what?
15 A This is the study for the Old Glory
16 Park view study, 1993 by Buckerst, Fish, Hulton,
17 Katz & Jacquemart document, and I am referring to
18 it because it's a simple way to explain -- in
19 fact, I would like to take this one step further,
20 if you will permit me.
21 I know three-D things can be difficult for
22 people, and this, I think, explains it so that
23 everyone can understand.
24 MR. KIENZ: Let the record show
25 that he is pulling out a rope.
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121
1 THE WITNESS: Laura, if you could
2 take this rope and walk your end over
3 there. Okay. Please stand on your end of
4 the rope, and I would like to invite
5 everyone here to imagine that Laura is
6 standing, by the miracle of things that
7 some of us believe in and others don't, in
8 the middle of the Hudson River at mean low
9 water, which is minus one foot six.
10 I, on the other hand, even though
11 relatively speaking this isn't correct, I
12 am standing on the easterly curb line of
13 Boulevard East at an elevation, and I am
14 looking directly out to the centerline of
15 the river.
16 Since I am the normal American male,
17 my eyeball happens to be at exactly five
18 feet above the point that I am standing on.
19 That's the referenced height above the curb
20 line for the view elevation, so by looking
21 -- sighting down this string here to the
22 object in the centerline of the river, I
23 must have an absolutely clear view.
24 If anything was to come up and
25 penetrate this line or block that line of
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
122
1 sight, it would be in violation of the
2 North Weehawken view plane.
3 Our proposal is completely in
4 compliance with that requirement.
5 Q Now, with that section you were
6 referring to, Subsection (b) under g.1 on Page
7 2382. Is that correct?
8 A That's correct.
9 Q Let's go to the next full section.
10 The next section says, "No building, rooftop
11 structure, other structure or sign located north
12 of easterly prolongation of the centerline of
13 Cooper Place shall penetrate the Palisades Plane."
14 Would you explain -- please explain that.
15 MR. WEIR: Plate 222.
16 THE WITNESS: Yes, referencing the
17 zoning map again to orient the board, the
18 area that the Palisades plane starts at the
19 northerly edge of the North Weehawken view
20 plane and proceeds northerly to the
21 township line with West New York.
22 This is the area of our site here.
23 Steve, could you go back to the PD
24 map, please.
25 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
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123
1 THE WITNESS: Referencing it back
2 to our own PD, that line at the southerly
3 stream falls here at Buildings 8 and 9 and
4 proceeds all the way to the north to the
5 West New York line.
6 The requirement for the Palisades
7 plane is that from the lowest point on top
8 of the PD zone here at the easterly curb
9 line of Boulevard East, an imaginary plane
10 is put horizontally into space.
11 Steve, if you could go back.
12 MR. WEIR: Plate 215.
13 THE WITNESS: You can see in this
14 graphic from the lowest point here on the
15 westerly boundary, a horizontal line this
16 time, not a sloping line, is stricken, and
17 no building may penetrate that dimension
18 within that zone.
19 I would point out to the board that
20 the applicant in this -- in this procedure
21 has voluntarily taken it upon himself to
22 hold his designers to the more stringent
23 requirement for the North Weehawken view,
24 the sloping line, for the entirety of the
25 site, and, therefore, our own mandated
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
124
1 constraints by our client are more
2 constricting to the building heights than
3 would be the zoning.
4 Q So we meet that requirement.
5 Is that your conclusion?
6 A Yes, we do.
7 Q Subparagraph (d) has requirements
8 for beautification of rooftops.
9 Would you explain that and what is our
10 intention in regard to that section of the
11 ordinance.
12 A Yes. There is a specific
13 requirement that from the view elevations at top
14 of the Palisades, when one is looking easterly
15 toward the river, any rooftop areas must be
16 beautified, and we stipulate as part of our -- of
17 this prelim -- okay -- we stipulate as part of our
18 preliminary PD application before you here that we
19 will comply completely with all rooftop areas that
20 are visible directly from viewpoint elevations
21 that will be landscaped.
22 The details for those landscaping plans
23 will be part of a site plan approval process.
24 Q Subsection (e) of the ordinance
25 provides that "No building, rooftop structure,
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
125
1 other structure or sign located north of the
2 King's Bluff Dividing Line shall penetrate the Old
3 Glory Park Harbor View Plane."
4 Will we comply with that section?
5 A Yes, we do, and to illustrate what
6 they are talking about --
7 MR. WEIR: Plate 218.
8 THE WITNESS: This is a sketch of
9 the Old Glory Park view study that was done
10 by Mr. Albert Feraldi in 1999 -- 1994, and
11 on the top plate you can see the Old Glory
12 Park Harbor view, which is this box here.
13 Steve, if you could go to the map we
14 had on just before -- I am sorry -- not the
15 one before, the Old Glory Park view study.
16 MR. WEIR: Plate 221.
17 THE WITNESS: That's correct, which
18 parenthetically leads me to the fact that I
19 misreferenced the diagram on the screen
20 before that.
21 That's not the Old Glory Park view
22 study. That was the plate of the master
23 plan.
24 I apologize for that. The Old Glory
25 view park site here, this is the viewpoint
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
126
1 of Old Glory Park, and that leeds to the
2 viewbox that you saw on the prior slide is
3 this area here at the Holland Tunnel.
4 In fact, as this sketch indicates,
5 from the viewpoint itself, the
6 line-of-sight requirement for that harbor
7 view is described by the easterly face of
8 the Holland Tunnel vent on the New York
9 side and the westerly face of the Holland
10 Tunnel on the New Jersey side. That is, in
11 fact, the harbor view.
12 As one stands at the viewpoint, if I
13 can just be illustrative again, you swing
14 an arc from zero degrees through 90 degrees
15 to 30 minutes and 15 seconds, slightly
16 lower than the horizontal line, anything
17 above that line within that arc must be
18 kept clear of the building size or other
19 encumbrances.
20 We do comply with that.
21 Q Now, the next full section of the
22 ordinance concerns south of the King's Bluff
23 dividing line.
24 Does that apply to this project?
25 A No.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 Our entire application is for the area that
2 is north of the King's Bluff dividing line.
3 Q Subsection 3, which is on Page 2384,
4 has a requirement for the "Entire Planned
5 Development District."
6 That requirement states that "The
7 buildings, rooftop structures, other structures or
8 signs built in the Planned Development District
9 shall not obstruct more than 20 percent in the
10 aggregate of the centerline of the Hudson River
11 within the Old Glory Park Skyline View Area."
12 Would you please explain that section and
13 whether we comply with it or not.
14 A Absolutely.
15 THE WITNESS: Steve, could you
16 return to the previous slide, which is the
17 study.
18 MR. WEIR: The two views?
19 THE WITNESS: The Old Glory.
20 MR. WEIR: Plate 218, is this
21 the one?
22 THE WITNESS: Yes, that's the
23 correct slide.
24 Here in the lower illustration you
25 see a box area that runs -- I will tell you
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
128
1 now -- from the westerly extension of 58th
2 Street in Manhattan, where it intersects
3 the New York shoreline, to the visible tip
4 of Manhattan Island.
5 This area here is the view in
6 question.
7 Q What is the requirement of that
8 section of the ordinance?
9 A The requirement of that section of
10 the ordinance is that, as one stands at the
11 viewpoint, one must be able to see a -- in an
12 unobstructed manner from the 58th Street portion
13 through to the tip of Manhattan more than 80
14 percent of the centerline of the Hudson River.
15 It's interesting to note that in their
16 study they make a specific reference to the fact
17 that buildings built on the existing land mass
18 would in all eventuality have no impact on that.
19 I think what they were trying to get toward
20 would be buildings that would have been built out
21 on pier structures or additional land areas. We
22 have looked at this. We have done some
23 mathematical calculations, and we are well, well,
24 well below any 20 percent number, complete
25 conforming.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
129
1 Q Section 23-10.4h, which is on Page
2 2384, talks about the "Prohibited Location of
3 Buildings."
4 The first paragraph talks about the
5 Palisades preservation setback. That's a rather
6 long paragraph.
7 Would you explain what that paragraph
8 means, Michael.
9 A Yes.
10 MR. WEIR: Plate 195.
11 THE WITNESS: Okay. The Palisades
12 preservation setback is comprised of,
13 basically, two components.
14 There is, firstoff, the area that
15 lies to the west of the Conrail
16 right-of-way 48th Street. 48th Street
17 comes in this area here, the area to the
18 west. This is the Conrail line shown here
19 as a black line. The area to the west is,
20 in effect, the Palisades. That area is a
21 no-build zone.
22 To the north of 48th Street there is
23 an area described on the town map, which
24 falls here, and within that area, if one
25 were to imagine a line drawn in the
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
130
1 centerline Boulevard East here projecting
2 easterly 350 feet, you are not allowed to
3 build within that zone, although existing
4 roads are allowed to be improved, relocated
5 and/or expanded within that zone.
6 Q Would you please explain the
7 development that's contemplated in that zone and
8 how it complies.
9 A Okay. Unfortunately, I have to
10 share with the board that on the set of drawings
11 that is currently before the board there is a
12 drafting mistake, which we have caught, and we
13 have, of course, planned to make corrections to
14 that.
15 That mistake is as follows: Shortly before
16 we submitted the plan in mid-July, we had a layout
17 in this area of the site which called for the
18 waterfront walkway to be built as an over-water
19 structure, and our consultants, in the waterfront
20 development permit area, PS&S, have had ongoing
21 conversations with the DEP regarding how the
22 waterfront walkway will work, et cetera.
23 They came back and they allowed us -- the
24 New Jersey DEP was not going to -- interested in
25 having the waterfront walkway built out over
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131
1 water, and, therefore, the geometry in this area
2 was shifted, depending on where you were along the
3 line, it was shifted some 30 to 35 feet westerly.
4 When that occurred those buildings that had
5 been designed were meerly slid to the west, and
6 the drawings were published, printed and sent out.
7 During our review of those submissions, it
8 came to light that in making that shift we had
9 inadvertently placed Building 1 over the 350-foot
10 setback line and the very, very corner of Building
11 4, which is this parking structure here over that
12 line, we have since then made modifications to the
13 size of those two structures in those areas.
14 We have maintained the amount of square
15 footage inside the buildings, and we have
16 maintained the parking inside the buildings
17 through some redesigns of the interiors.
18 We have not changed the height of the
19 buildings. We have only changed the westerly
20 building line.
21 Q This was they got to close to that
22 350 feet. Is that correct?
23 A They got to close, and they have
24 been brought back in.
25 Q That part of the modifications will
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132
1 be made to the plans as part of the ongoing
2 process once we get engineering reviews and
3 planning reviews and other things. Is that
4 correct?
5 A That's correct.
6 As in the course of any hearing like this
7 there will be multiple comments from board
8 professionals and board members themselves,
9 perhaps, that -- that will result in this kind of
10 deminimous fine-tuning.
11 MR. SEGRETO: Can you tell me when
12 those revised plans will be available, if
13 you know?
14 MR. DUNN: Is that an objection?
15 MR. KIENZ: The revised plans
16 will be prepared when we have the comments
17 and we can do the revisions so that it
18 doesn't get confusing, and there are
19 revisions here and revisions there, so we
20 are waiting for the comments from the
21 board's professionals, if we can ever get
22 to them, to actually incorporate them into
23 one document rather than doing it from a
24 piecemeal, haphazard approach, which would
25 be much confusing to everyone.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
133
1 MR. DUNN: They will be the
2 subject of further examination, direct
3 examination and cross-examination, will
4 they?
5 MR. KIENZ: Yes.
6 MR. DUNN: Okay.
7 MR. KIENZ: Sure.
8 We will come out and say we conform
9 with the engineers' recommendations, and we
10 have done it, and that will probably be the
11 extent of it.
12 MR. DUNN: Okay.
13 Q Michael, let's go back to Section
14 h.1.
15 Is it your testimony then that we satisfy
16 and meet the Palisades preservation setback
17 section of the ordinance?
18 A Yes.
19 Q The next section is "Limited Build
20 Zone."
21 That doesn't apply to this portion of the
22 property, to our portion of the property at all,
23 does it?
24 A No, it doesn't.
25 That refers to a line some 70 feet from the
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
134
1 westerly boundary of the Conrail right-of-way.
2 Our PD doesn't contemplate any construction in
3 that area at all.
4 Q The next section talks about
5 "Minimum Distances Between Buildings."
6 MR. DUNN: What page are we on
7 now?
8 MR. KIENZ: I am sorry, Mr. Dunn,
9 Page 2385, and we are in Section h.3.
10 THE WITNESS: Yes. There are
11 several building separation distance
12 requirements, the principal one being that
13 at grade level. No building shall be
14 closer than 60 feet from face-to-face.
15 We are in full compliance with that.
16 In fact, in most areas of this PD we
17 are in excess of the required width. We
18 have a 60-foot corridor in this region
19 here. We have an 80-foot corridor.
20 Q Michael, you have to say between
21 which buildings.
22 A I am sorry.
23 Between Buildings 1 and 3.
24 Q Building 1 is what?
25 A Is the office structure, and
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135
1 Building 3 is a parking garage and office
2 structure.
3 Between Buildings 11 and 13 in this area
4 here, we have provided an 80-foot wide building
5 separation.
6 In other areas, as you can see, that
7 separation gets quite large. We are in full
8 conformance with the 60-foot required.
9 Q Does that also require a 100-foot
10 separation?
11 A Yes, further, the 60-foot
12 requirement -- in addition, there is a requirement
13 that at an elevation 100 feet above the building
14 line at grade that there be a 100-foot separation
15 between structures, and we have made full
16 compliance there as well.
17 All of our buildings -- wedding cake we
18 refer to it -- they step back from their grade
19 level facades, principally at an elevation at or
20 below 80 feet, in fact, and at 100 feet they are
21 all in full compliance with the 100-foot
22 separation.
23 Q Subsection (b) of that paragraph
24 provides that there must be an east-west view
25 corridor of at least 60 feet in the planned
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
136
1 development north of the King's Bluff dividing
2 line.
3 Would you please show where that is and
4 tell me -- tell how we comply.
5 A I would call to the board's
6 attention that our entire site lies north of the
7 King's Bluff dividing line. All of our east/west
8 streets in the grid that we have created here are
9 to mimic the upper Weehawken street grid to comply
10 as view corridors at grade. They are all, as I
11 just stated, 60 feet or wider. We are in full
12 compliance with that section.
13 It goes on to say that at an elevation of
14 80 feet above the grade level of the buildings,
15 you must have from the centerline of the required
16 60-foot view corridor a minimum dimension of 50
17 feet to the building face.
18 That, again, is a parallel, if you will,
19 requirement to the 100-foot separation
20 requirement, although it does require that the
21 measurement be taken from a centerline, not from
22 building face to building face, and that it be
23 done at 80 feet as opposed to the 100 feet of the
24 other ordinance.
25 That's why I allude to the fact that our
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137
1 buildings are a wedding cake at an elevation at or
2 below 80 feet.
3 Q That's shown on the plans that have
4 been submitted --
5 A Yes.
6 Q -- as part of this application. Is
7 that correct?
8 A That's correct.
9 Q Subsection (c) under three on Page
10 2386, provides that "In the Planned Development
11 District north of the southerly boundary of the
12 North Weehawken view plane there shall be, (1),
13 the Old Glory Park view corridor -- let's take
14 that. Would you please explain that.
15 A Yes, I can explain that quite
16 simply.
17 THE WITNESS: Steve, would you
18 please put on the zone view corridor
19 diagram. I don't know the number.
20 MR. WEIR: This is a series of
21 frames, 19720 to 19930, but, I believe,
22 there is a print in the binder as well.
23 THE WITNESS: Okay. The Old Glory
24 Park view corridor is a defined term in the
25 ordinance. It is a special view corridor.
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138
1 It is a 100-foot wide view corridor,
2 and the view corridor must focus around the
3 Old Glory Park viewing point, which is a
4 described location in your ordinance in
5 terms of latitude, longitude, as well as a
6 specific height above the existing grade,
7 which happens to be -- that 100-foot swath
8 which becomes the Old Glory Park view
9 corridor is allowed to go here as shown
10 here directly perpendicular to the pier
11 head line, or it can swing in an arc of up
12 to 30 degrees in a southerly fashion from
13 the viewing point.
14 Steve, could you go to our PD plan.
15 MR. WEIR: This is a series of
16 frames.
17 THE WITNESS: PD plan.
18 MR. WEIR: I am sorry.
19 Plate 195.
20 THE WITNESS: This is the region of
21 Old Glory Park here.
22 The viewing point has not been
23 located on the site plan, but it is in this
24 region, and if you look carefully -- I was
25 afraid this exhibit wasn't really designed
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1 to demonstrate this specifically --
2 Building 3 and Building 4 are separated by
3 quite some area here.
4 The parking structure is at a low
5 elevation below. There is a required 100
6 feet of separation distance between these
7 two buildings, which provides the Old Glory
8 Park view corridor in that region, the
9 angle of deflection, if you will, or
10 rotation is 16 degrees well within the
11 allowable 30 degree rotation.
12 Q So it's your testimony that we
13 satisfy the Old Glory Park view corridor?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Okay. How about the the 51st Street
16 view corridor?
17 THE WITNESS: Steve, if you could
18 return to the zone view corridor
19 map.
20 The 51st -- the 51st Street view
21 corridor is a second special view corridor.
22 It exists at the foot of 51st Street. It
23 is an 80-foot wide view corridor, and there
24 is some latitude in the location of that
25 view corridor.
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1 In fact, the view corridor is
2 allowed to pass over the top of the soils
3 of West New York, if one so chooses.
4 We have provided an 80-foot view
5 corridor in that region of the site between
6 our northern most buildings, Building 1 and
7 Building 2, and the southern most buildings
8 of the West New York development.
9 Q What you are showing right now are
10 ordinance requirements. Is that correct?
11 A Yes.
12 Q And the blue represents what?
13 A In these diagrams the blue
14 represents areas that one could see or one is
15 required to be able to see under the ordinance.
16 Now, here there is --
17 Q Where is "here"? What are you
18 referring to?
19 A On this plate.
20 Q Okay.
21 A There is a requirement for multiple
22 view corridors, again, a defined term in the
23 ordinance. Those view corridors must be a minimum
24 of 60 feet wide. They must, wherever practicable,
25 be spaced no more than 600 feet from centerline to
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1 centerline, and they must aggregate in their north
2 to south dimension this way, to a minimum of 1150
3 feet.
4 Q Okay. This is not the result of our
5 constructing anything on the site?
6 A No.
7 Q These are the ordinance
8 requirements. Is that correct?
9 A That's correct. What we are showing
10 here is the ordinance requirement.
11 Q Anyplace that you see blue, blue
12 represent water, so under the ordinance we will
13 need to see water at any spot where there is a
14 blue line. Is that correct?
15 A In reference to view corridors, that
16 is correct.
17 We have a plate that shows our view
18 corridor approach under our PD.
19 THE WITNESS: Steve.
20 Q We will get to that in a second. We
21 are not quite there.
22 A No. Okay.
23 Q Under Subsection (3) on Page 2386,
24 there are "Other view corridors in the area
25 governed by the Palisades plane such that the
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 total width of the view corridors in that area,
2 including the Old Glory Park view corridor and the
3 51st Street view corridor," and the requirement is
4 "shall not be less than 250 feet at grade level"?
5 A That's correct.
6 Q Would you explain that, please.
7 THE WITNESS: Okay. Could we go
8 back to the overall PD map, please, Steve.
9 MR. WEIR: One second here.
10 Plate 195.
11 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
12 I just want to get the board's
13 forhearance again.
14 The area being discussed are these
15 for a minimum of 250-foot grade of open
16 view corridor is the area between the
17 northern boundary of the North Weehawken
18 view plane here and West New York. It's
19 this component of the PD up in here we have
20 provided the view corridors.
21 Steve, you could go back.
22 MR. GOULD: Mr. Kienz, I think
23 the court reporter is going to need a rest
24 here soon.
25 Is there a good point where you can
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1 break soon?
2 MR. KIENZ: I guess now.
3 MR. GOULD: Now.
4 MR. KIENZ: We will pick it up
5 from here. We stopped, so we might as well
6 stop.
7 MR. GOULD: We will take a
8 ten-minute recess.
9 (Whereupon, a short recess is
10 taken.)
11 MR. GOULD: Let's go back on the
12 record now.
13 What time do you have?
14 MR. DUNN: Eleven o'clock.
15 MR. GOULD: It's ten o'clock.
16 Can we have a roll call, please.
17 THE CLERK: Anthony Rosas.
18 MR. ROSAS: Here.
19 THE CLERK: Mr. Barsa.
20 MR. BARSA: Here.
21 THE CLERK: Mr. Turner.
22 MR. TURNER: Here.
23 THE CLERK: Mr. Gould.
24 MR. GOULD: Here.
25 THE CLERK: Mr. Cabrera.
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1 MR. CABRERA: Here.
2 THE CLERK: Ms. Kravitz.
3 MS. KRAVITZ: Here.
4 MR. GOULD: Okay. Mr. Kienz, are
5 you ready to continue?
6 MR. KIENZ: Absolutely.
7 MR. GOULD: Okay.
8 MR. SEGRETO: Mr. Chairman, I think
9 Mr. Kienz is going to be a while yet.
10 What's our time limit for tonight?
11 MR. GOULD: Ten o'clock is our
12 time limit, and I think what we will do
13 after this is we will take board questions
14 or comments and any questions from the
15 public not represented by you, and that
16 will probably carry us to the end of the
17 night, so we will come back at the next
18 meeting with your cross-examination.
19 MR. SEGRETO: I will go home
20 unfulfilled.
21 MR. GOULD: That are -- I am
22 sorry to do that.
23 MR. DUNN: You are not
24 objecting, Mr. Segreto.
25 We can accommodate you. You are not
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 objecting. We can let you start your
2 cross.
3 Let's go. It's now 10:04.
4 MR. GOULD: Please continue, Mr.
5 Kienz.
6 Q I believe, before the break,
7 Michael, we were dealing with Page 2386 and
8 specifically Paragraph (c)(3), which dealt with
9 other view corridors in the area governed by the
10 Palisades plane, such as the total width of the
11 view corridors.
12 Will you explain that section again so
13 everybody's refresh your recollection is
14 refreshed.
15 A Yes, I will explain that again.
16 We are talking about the region which falls
17 within the purview of the Palisades plane, that
18 is, the region in the southern extreme falls where
19 I am --
20 Q Mike, keep your voice up. I am
21 having trouble hearing you over here.
22 A And goes northerly to the West New
23 York borderline with Weehawken. It's this region
24 of the site here.
25 The stipulation in the requirement is that
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1 a minimum of 250 feet of measured northwest view
2 corridor at grade be established in that zone.
3 You are allowed to include the 51st Street view
4 corridor.
5 Unfortunately, on the slide it is right off
6 the page.
7 If you will, there is an 80-foot view
8 corridor that exists to the north of Building 1
9 and to the north of Building 2 here. That will be
10 shown on a slide that I will refresh in a minute.
11 I want you to just imagine, however, that
12 it's in this location, an 80-foot view corridor.
13 There is a 60 view foot corridor in this location
14 here. There is a 97-foot view corridor between
15 Building 7 and the southern extreme of Buildings 4
16 and 5, and there is a 60-foot view corridor at
17 this location here between Buildings 8, 9 -- I am
18 sorry -- between Building 7 and between Buildings
19 8 and 9.
20 Q Can we go to -- the other slide will
21 show that?
22 A Yes.
23 THE WITNESS: Steve, if you want to
24 put up the proposal view corridor slide,
25 please.
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1 MR. WEIR: This is frames 19960
2 to 20180.
3 MR. DUNN: Is this a plate?
4 MR. KIENZ: Yes.
5 What plate is this?
6 MR. WEIR: I do not have a plate
7 number on my code sheet.
8 It is in the binder, though.
9 MR. DUNN: Let's identify it,
10 please.
11 MS. KRAVITZ: 211.
12 MR. GOULD: 210.
13 THE WITNESS: Probably 207.
14 MS. KRAVITZ: 210.
15 MR. GOULD: 212.
16 MR. ROSAS: 212.
17 MR. GOULD: 212.
18 Q All right. For the record, with one
19 voice, this is Plate 212. Is that correct?
20 MR. WEIR: Yes, Plate 212.
21 THE WITNESS: Okay.
22 Q Michael, would you please explain
23 what this shows based on the testimony you just
24 gave.
25 A This plate depicts all of the view
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1 corridors that we have provided in the design of
2 our PD, and I will get to the point that the
3 overall plate makes in a minute.
4 The region we were talking about relative
5 to your question is this zone here, and this is
6 where there is the 80-foot 51st Street view
7 corridor -- 60-foot view corridors between
8 Buildings 1 and 4, and these combinations in this
9 region here, a 97-foot view corridor that falls
10 between the southern extreme of Building 4 and the
11 northern extreme of Building 7 and an additional
12 60-foot here between Building 7 and Buildings 8,
13 9. The sum of those totals is 297 feet. The
14 requirement is a minimum of 250 feet.
15 Therefore, I conclude we met that provision
16 of the ordinance.
17 Q Okay. The next section requires
18 "Other view corridors such that the total width of
19 all such view corridors, including Old Glory Park
20 view corridor, the 51st Street view corridor and
21 all other view corridors in the area governed by
22 the Palisades plane, shall be not less than 1,150
23 feet at grade level."
24 Will you explain whether we comply with
25 that section.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 THE WITNESS: Steve, if you could
2 go back to the zone view corridor slide,
3 please.
4 MR. WEIR: This will be Plate
5 211 in your binder.
6 THE WITNESS: The members of the
7 board will recall the zone view corridor
8 requirement is that a 60-foot view corridor
9 occur at no greater than a 600-foot
10 centerline to centerline dimension, and
11 that the aggregate of the north/south
12 dimension of all those view corridors must
13 come to a minimum of 1,150 feet.
14 Q Let's put that -- what?
15 A If one were to take this 60 and add
16 it to that 60, and add it to that 60, and add it
17 to that 60, throughout prescribed spacing of the
18 ordinance.
19 Q That all has to total to what?
20 A A minimum of 1,150.
21 Q Okay.
22 THE WITNESS: Okay. Steve, if you
23 could return now to the PD slide with the
24 view corridors.
25 MR. WEIR: Excuse me.
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1 The proposed corridors, Plate 212.
2 THE WITNESS: Here in this slide we
3 have illustrated, not in the zoning
4 resultant view corridors, but the actual
5 view corridors provided through the design
6 of our PD.
7 You can see just graphically here
8 that we have provided well in excess of the
9 spacing required, well in excess of the
10 area required, and, in fact, our total
11 summation of all of the appropriate view
12 corridors under this section of the
13 ordinance referred to is in excess of twice
14 the amount required by the ordinance.
15 MR. DUNN: Mr. Giardino, I am
16 looking at what appears to be the harbor
17 view plane lines?
18 THE WITNESS: These lines.
19 MR. DUNN: Is that shown on that
20 plan?
21 THE WITNESS: Yes, these two lines.
22 MR. DUNN: And which of the
23 buildings -- what are the building numbers
24 of the buildings that lie within that
25 harbor view plane?
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1 THE WITNESS: This building here?
2 MR. KIENZ: Yes.
3 THE WITNESS: Yes, Building 13.
4 MR. DUNN: Right.
5 THE WITNESS: This building here is
6 Building 15.
7 This building here is Building 16,
8 and I will give you credit, I don't know if
9 it nips it or not, that building there it's
10 a lower building, it's Building 19.
11 In addition, there is Arthur's
12 Landing Restaurant in here, the marina and
13 a portion of the brownstones.
14 MR. GOULD: What about the one
15 northwest of the rotonda?
16 THE WITNESS: It may also clip
17 Building 11.
18 Q Another requirement of this
19 ordinance is "To the extent practicable, view
20 corridors shall be provided at intervals of not
21 more than 600 feet from centerline to centerline."
22 Do the plans satisfy that requirement as
23 submitted?
24 A Absolutely. Our view corridors are
25 well under the spacing requirements. Typically,
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1 in our mix-use residential section here they are
2 300 feet.
3 Q Do you want to discuss some height
4 issues?
5 A Yes. As I mentioned earlier, we
6 have taken it upon ourselves to adhere to the
7 North Weehawken view plane for the entire site,
8 and I would like to share with you how we have
9 tested our design and know that we are in
10 compliance with that.
11 THE WITNESS: Steve, could you show
12 us the overall site plan and the second
13 location that we are going to refer to,
14 which is at Buildings 13 and 15, I believe.
15 MR. WEIR: Okay. 13, 14.
16 THE WITNESS: What I would like to
17 do is take a section -- start that again,
18 please, and freeze it.
19 MR. WEIR: Okay.
20 THE WITNESS: I would like to take
21 a section -- that's freezing it all right.
22 MR. WEIR: Let me try again.
23 THE WITNESS: I would like to take
24 a section, which will go through the
25 Palisades along the northerly line of the
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1 building phase of Building 13 and the
2 northerly building phase of Building 14,
3 and if you can imagine the extension of
4 that line all the way out through the
5 centerline of the Hudson River.
6 Okay. Let it run.
7 MR. WEIR: I will restart it
8 again.
9 Let me look at the binder for a
10 minute while we are on this. This is Plate
11 226
12 THE WITNESS: Steve, I want to come
13 back to this. The graphic quality isn't as
14 strong as I would have hoped.
15 I think we have another generic
16 graphic that may have some stronger lines
17 on it.
18 MR. WEIR: Okay.
19 THE WITNESS: Here we go. Okay.
20 So we are here. Could you freeze it here?
21 This is the view elevation.
22 MR. GOULD: What plate number is
23 this?
24 MR. WEIR: I am not sure if this
25 is a video sequence. I am not sure if it's
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 in the binder.
2 MR. DUNN: If it's not in the
3 binder, we can't use it.
4 MR. SEGRETO: Is counsel going to
5 let me have one of these graphics if it's
6 not in the binder?
7 MR. DUNN: If it's not in the
8 binder, it's not been identified, it's not
9 been marked for identification, I am not
10 going to allow testimony with respect to
11 it, and it hasn't been marked for
12 identification.
13 When it has been marked for
14 identification you will have a copy.
15 MR. SEGRETO: I take it the witness
16 will not be permitted to testify now as to
17 this one.
18 MR. KIENZ: What we will do, we
19 will go back to the other graphic. We are
20 trying to use this for clarity. We can use
21 the other graphic if we have to.
22 It's, essentially, the same?
23 THE WITNESS: Absolutely.
24 MR. KIENZ: This would have made
25 it easier. We will certainly go back to
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 the other one. Let's go back to the other
2 one.
3 MR. DUNN: If it were in the
4 binder, there would be no objection to it,
5 Mr. Kienz.
6 MR. WEIR: I don't believe that
7 animated stuff is in the binder.
8 Q Let's go back to the other one.
9 A I am sorry. We should have had hard
10 copies.
11 Geof, could you return to the prior,
12 please.
13 MR. KIENZ: Steve, just go back.
14 MR. WEIR: I have to get the
15 number.
16 MR. KIENZ: 226, I believe, it
17 is.
18 MR. WEIR: I believe it is, yes,
19 226
20 THE WITNESS: Okay. Recall again
21 we are going to take a section of the
22 northerly face of the buildings, 13 and 14,
23 and here is that section.
24 You will have to just follow my
25 discussion and my laser pointer because the
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 graphic is a little bit weak here.
2 From the view elevation, which is at
3 0.5 feet above the curb line of Boulevard
4 East, if you recall the string that we held
5 out earlier today, there is line of sight
6 that runs along and eventually over here by
7 the north somewhere and meets the
8 centerline of the Hudson River at an
9 elevation of minus 1.6 feet, which is mean
10 low water.
11 No building may penetrate that line
12 under the ordinance, and no building within
13 the North Weehawken view plane area, no
14 building may penetrate that line anywhere
15 in our project. Under the authority of our
16 client he has mandated that.
17 So what we have done is we have
18 taken our site plan and, as you saw, as
19 this rotated out, we have located, through
20 the auspices of PS&S, precisely, we have
21 located the elevation of the viewpoint.
22 Q That's where?
23 A Up on Boulevard East.
24 Q Okay.
25 A We have located the distance from
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1 the viewpoint to Building 13. We know the sizes
2 of these buildings, of course, as laid out on the
3 site plan. We know the separation distances and
4 the street distances. Those are all prescribed
5 here.
6 This was all done with the aid of
7 computers, of course, and we know how far it is to
8 the centerline of the river from the viewpoint in
9 a horizontal manner.
10 We also know what the elevation variation
11 is between the minus 1.6 feet and the view
12 elevation, so this line is described, the
13 locations of these buildings are described. We
14 then go to a corner of the building.
15 Q Which corner are you referring to?
16 A Here I am pointing to the northwest
17 corner of Building 13, and we strike a line that
18 would go directly zero degrees, if you will, in
19 the air, straight up, and at some point that line
20 will intersect as a figmentary intersection with
21 the required view plane line.
22 Using our computers, we were able to
23 generate an exact elevation relative to sea level
24 of that intersection point, so we have no
25 intersection points for all of the buildings
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 within the PD at that line. We also designed
2 schematic buildings in order to plan the PD.
3 We use them to establish, as Laura
4 testified to earlier, the various square footages
5 and uses, mix of uses, so we know what the bulk of
6 our buildings is to a very reasonable degree.
7 We have done these calculations for every
8 building at the north face and at the south face
9 using specifically surveyed points relative to
10 those buildings in the field, and we have verified
11 that all the buildings are in full compliance with
12 the north Weehawken view plane.
13 Q Now, what's the upper box? You
14 didn't explain that.
15 A The upper box here is the elevation
16 of the fictitious intersection between that zero
17 degree line and the view plane line. That, in
18 effect, is the zoning perimeter that may not be
19 exceeded at that point in space.
20 There is a series of these spots taken at
21 both the westerly and easterly faces of each of
22 the buildings on both the northern -- northern and
23 southern lanes as they sit in the plane, so we
24 describe the box, it's the space, if you will,
25 that the building may not penetrate.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 Q Now you have said you have done
2 calculations for each one of the buildings being
3 proposed. Is that correct?
4 A Yes, that is correct, and I believe
5 we have brought along an exhibit tonight to place
6 on the record which contains detailed sections of
7 this nature for every building.
8 Q You have given a summary of two
9 buildings and how it works, but you have done
10 these calculations?
11 A For every location, every building.
12 MR. KIENZ: And, I think -- I
13 have taken the liberty, Mr. Chairman, for
14 identification purposes, of marking this as
15 Exhibit A-16.
16 MR. GOULD: Okay. So marked.
17 MR. KIENZ: This is the official,
18 and I have a box -- there are 29 copies in
19 this box of A-16 --
20 MR. GOULD: Okay.
21 MR. KIENZ: -- Mr. Segreto.
22 MR. SEGRETO: Thank you very much.
23 MR. DUNN: Can we identify A-16
24 more precisely for the record?
25 (Proposed Development View Sections,
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 12/1/99, is marked as Exhibit A-16 for
2 identification.)
3 MR. KIENZ: Yes, Mr. Dunn, except
4 I don't have a copy.
5 A-16, for the record, shall be
6 identified as Proposed Development View
7 Sections with a date on it of 12/1/99,
8 consisting of five sheets prepared by the
9 Martin Architectural Group.
10 MR. SEGRETO: What is this being
11 marked?
12 MR. KIENZ: A-16, Mr. Segreto.
13 MR. SEGRETO: I don't recall, but
14 is this gentleman with the Martin
15 Architectural Group?
16 MR. KIENZ: Yes, he is.
17 Q Michael, is there anything more you
18 want to talk about on this plate?
19 A I don't believe so.
20 Q Okay.
21 MR. DUNN: What does the purple
22 mean?
23 THE WITNESS: Okay. Let me refer
24 to the purple in a moment, if you will.
25 MR. DUNN: All right.
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1 Q What do you want to discuss next,
2 Michael?
3 A Well, I would like to share with the
4 board -- we just spent some minutes talking about
5 all of those various controls that the ordinance
6 places on us for view corridors, view planes,
7 building heights, et cetera.
8 I would like to share with you what the net
9 result of all of this really means, put it in
10 terms that you can visualize what's going on
11 because it is complex and there are many
12 components to it.
13 In order to do that, we prepared what we
14 referred to as an open water view study.
15 THE WITNESS: And, Steve, if you
16 would please put on the zone version of the
17 open water view study.
18 MR. WEIR: This would be Plate
19 209
20 Q Okay. Let's take this one component
21 at a time, Michael.
22 What does this plate show? What's the
23 light blue?
24 A Okay. What this plate was created
25 to depict is, if one were to take the liberal code
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1 and say, as a premise, I want to be able to
2 obstruct or demonstrate how much I am permitted to
3 obstruct of the view of open water from the
4 viewpoint elevations as they go all the way across
5 Boulevard East using the North Palisades plane,
6 the North Weehawken view plane and the Palisades
7 plane, in other words, strict conformance to the
8 ordinance as written.
9 What this graphic depicts is, in the light
10 blue, the areas of the river that one would be
11 allowed to obstruct from view and, in the dark
12 blue, the areas of the river which would remain
13 open to view under the ordinance, and, as you can
14 see here, the impact or obscured water area, if
15 you will, would be 40 percent or 43 percent -- I
16 am sorry -- of the river directly opposite our PD,
17 43 percent would be obstructed, 57 percent would
18 be visible, the blue part -- the dark blue part
19 visible, including the view corridors themselves
20 and the light blue parts obstructed.
21 We then --
22 MR. DUNN: Excuse me, Mr.
23 Giardino, on Plate 209 as -- the copy
24 that's in the official record doesn't show
25 blue. It shows different shadings of gray.
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1 THE WITNESS: I have to refer to
2 that plate, 209.
3 MR. GOULD: Here.
4 THE WITNESS: Okay. On Plate 209,
5 as it's shown in the booklet before you,
6 the darker tone is what I have referred to
7 as dark blue and the light gray tone is
8 what I have referred to as the pale blue.
9 The darker tone in the book, the darker
10 gray is the open view, and the light gray
11 tone is the obscured water area.
12 MR. DUNN: Okay.
13 THE WITNESS: I assume that will
14 hold true for the next plate as well.
15 Steve, could you proceed and show us
16 --
17 Q Just since we got off the track, the
18 light blue then impacted water under the
19 ordinance, this is a pure extrapolation of the
20 ordinance is 43 percent. That was your testimony.
21 Is that correct?
22 A That's correct, just --
23 Q The open water is 57 percent. Is
24 that correct?
25 A The open water view is 57 percent.
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1 Q Okay.
2 MR. WEIR: This would be Plate
3 210
4 THE WITNESS: Okay. This is the
5 result of all you are -- of our hard work
6 to control building heights and introduce
7 additional view corridors.
8 As you can see here, dark blue or in
9 your pamphlet the dark gray, which
10 represents the visible open water, has shot
11 up from 57 to 86 percent and the impacted
12 water has been reduced to 14 percent,
13 basically, a two-thirds reduction.
14 I think that of all the things you
15 can use to try to visualize what the
16 controls of your ordinance are all about
17 and what this proposal is all about, these
18 two graphics are probably the most fully
19 telling things that we can show you.
20 Q Let's just go back so that everyone
21 can see the previous plate once more.
22 MR. WEIR: Plate 209.
23 THE WITNESS: Here again under the
24 ordinance.
25 Q That's the ordinance as of right --
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 what it's zoned for?
2 A Yes.
3 Q The other plate.
4 MR. WEIR: Plate 210.
5 THE WITNESS: Okay. Now, to answer
6 Mr. Dunn's question of a moment ago, you
7 will notice that we have prescribed lines
8 here that are less than the centerline in
9 the river.
10 Could you go back to the prior
11 building section graphic at 13 and 15,
12 please.
13 MR. WEIR: Okay. This is 226.
14 THE WITNESS: Mr. Dunn, you had
15 requested an explanation for this blue
16 elevation here.
17 If one were to do the open water
18 study as zoned, the elevation for the view
19 occlusion point, the point on the building
20 that defines how much you can and can't see
21 of the river would be prescribed by the
22 zoned intersection of this line and the
23 view plane line here. That's the red
24 number. Okay?
25 We have in our arsenal schematic
Giardino - Direct - Kienz
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1 building designs, which I referred to
2 earlier, where we have projected actual
3 elevations of hard parapet, et cetera,
4 within the context of a schematic building
5 design. That's this lower number. We tend
6 to be conservative in our work.
7 We didn't want to use that lower
8 number to do our open water view study, so
9 what we did, we struck another line, and
10 that line is clear of our building envelope
11 by a margin that gives us some fluff,
12 little factor of safety in there,
13 structural variations and the like, and we
14 use those point elevations in the blue to
15 generate the open water study, so, in
16 effect, the open water study itself was
17 conservative based upon our schematic
18 building design.
19 MR. ROSAS: The whole thing had
20 been figured out with an estimates study,
21 has been done, the estimate study?
22 THE WITNESS: I don't follow your
23 question, sir.
24 MR. ROSAS: The estimate, the
25 estimate, the total of the elevation.
Giardino - Direct - Kienz

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